Phonak unveils Lumity hearing aid platform

A lot of what you describe sounds like more a result of the tuning than the hearing aids themselves. Do you know if audiologist did REM? It sounds like you might be getting less gain. The sh sound instead of s is likely a result of frequency lowering settings.

@BeLo said:

The key phrase to watch out for is “Water resistance”, it should be “Waterproof”. Apple also admit that this resistance can diminish over time. How many dives do I get before it might fail on me?

The point of my post has nothing to do with scuba dives per se. Apple can make a device that can withstand a lot of water pressure that has both microphones and speakers. Phonak can’t make a device (according to BlueJay) that can survive a tumpover in a kayak. The point is if Apple (and other OEMs) can make devices so water-resistant, maybe Phonak and all the other HA OEMs can similarly improve their products and still have them reasonably functional - maybe you just get a little less sound quality but a tougher hearing aid. Then you take your choice as to what you want - robustness or sound quality and you choose your brand model accordingly.

Since Apple advertised that you could use the watch for swimming and water skiing, it’s got to be able to take a bunch of high-pressure water. And just like HA’s don’t last forever, if you’re just planning on swimming and water-skiing, the fact that the water resistance is going to wear out eventually is just something one has to accept, just like one’s expensive hearing aid, especially because of the rechargeable battery, is eventually going to wear out, too.

My post was about how water-resistant electronic devices can be - not whether it’s a wise decision to go scuba diving with an Apple Watch. As to the cost of a Lumity, most people are not into self-fitting, so the cost of the medical device is the cost of the device plus the medical service for its care and feeding over the 3-years or so of its warranted lifetime. I’m talking about buying premium hearing aids at audiology prices, not buying ~as good ones at Costco or maybe even less expensive but maybe pretty good OTC devices coming soon. And a $800 Apple watch is still cheaper than 2 HA’s at Costco and comes with a lot more bells and whistles, too! - including much better water-resistance.

Every company has lemons from time to time. I’ve owned and used quite a few smartphones in my life, and I’ve always found that both Samsung and Apple make pretty reliable products that do what’s claimed for them (and Samsung has been a supplier for a number of iPhone parts!). Apple’s basic success is probably not due to its hype (which can be considerable) but rather they control both the hardware and software and design stuff for normal people rather than geeks. And it usually just works.

@MDB said:

A lot of what you describe sounds like more a result of the tuning than the hearing aids themselves. Do you know if audiologist did REM?

As I said, I fully expect to do more tuning with my audiologist. So totally agree that I don’t think this is a problem with the aids. We didn’t do REM, but he can and will do it if we feel like the settings aren’t right.

[quote=“MDB, post:189, topic:70343, full:true”] It sounds like you might be getting less gain. The sh sound instead of s is likely a result of frequency lowering settings.
[/quote]

Yeah, just in terms of playing with the app, I think it sounds better when I adjust the equalizer to bring up the mids and highs just a tad.

Sorry Jim for the misunderstanding, yes I understand that was the point of your post.
I was just pointing out that it is very unlikely that Apple’s claims are actually true, especially as they have to add the huge caveat that the water resistance wears off making backing up those claims a very moveable feast.
A tumble in a kayak would expose the HAs to quite high temporary water pressures above 0.5-1m that they have been tested for. I spend a lot of time in the ocean and there’s no way I’d wear these for surfing or kayaking as they’d just get lost: pool maybe, but open water seems crazy to me. So I don’t see how making them resist 10m pressure of salt water would actually be helpful.
The only logical way to do this is to improve the receiver or use an Activevent type system to close the receiver completely when immersed. Either way this adds a lot of cost and complexity to a part that is known for it’s cheapness and replaceability. I’m not saying that it isn’t possible but you end up with receivers costing 4 times what they do now.
I’m paying $3,700 (£3,200) for a pair of Audeo Lumity Life L90-RL HA’s fully fitted with free audi appointments for life of HAs and extended manufacturer warranty as normal so I’ll just get the battery replaced in a couple of years under that. It would be about $1k cheaper to go DIY route but I want a real ear measurement to get them fitted optimally.

Yes, Apple are very good at design and usability (although that is subjective) it’s just that technological innovation isn’t their thing: they prefer to buy that in or confidentially use 3rd parties. The power of their marketing is such that a lot of people actually think that the iPhone was the first smartphone or that the iPad was the first tablet computer or even that the iPod was the first digital music player. All of those products had predecessors with identical functionality, in some cases many years previously, but I’ve even read well known journalists that think the opposite.

@MDB said:

The sh sound instead of s is likely a result of frequency lowering settings.

Talked to my audiologist today and he confirmed that SoundRecover is probably too aggressive. And we’ll dial that back when I go in for my follow up/adjustments. When he said that, I remembered that we had the same issue with my Marvels as well.

Online sold at Cyprus - slightly below 1500 USD. Worldwide delivery incl. of tax.

Saw this Phonak Deutschland clip on YouTube… sure infers “waterproof” to me.

Is that you, @1Bluejay?

@Stevyn said:

Saw this Phonak Deutschland clip on YouTube… sure infers “waterproof” to me.

LOL!!! That really gave me a good BELLY laugh! Did you notice, Holmes, that we never actually SEE the woman’s head submerged. We only infer that from the video.

Yours observantly,
Watson

@ryanb said:

I’m going to need some time to adjust, some time to play around with the settings in the app

Wow! Not only an outstanding review of the new Lumity Life aids, but also your tips about the phone app are very useful. I’ve always shied away from yet ANOTHER app on my phone, but looking at the Phonak website, I sure know I’d want to use the “Remote Control” settings capabilities pictured on this page5 (and below):

It seems straightforward that if I do download the app, I just do so from the Phonak website, and I see that my current cell phone, a Samsung Galaxy Z Flip4 is compatible with the Phonak app. If anyone has any other insights on the use (OR PROBS!) with Phonak’s phone app on the Lumity devices, share them.

@ryanb said:

Any tips on custom programs or settings that are more useful? I already tried creating one that dialed back the noise cancellation a bit.

I can see I’ll have to PRINT OUT and refer to your detailed review … cuz I have another question for you (or any other Lumity Life wearers): What kind of “custom programs” do you mean? There is that long list of available programs that my audi typically sets up for me: Speech in LOUD Noise, Comfort in Echo, Acoustic Phone, so is that what you’re referring to? That you could not only select which of these programs to put in what order (Default, Program 1, 2, 3) on the Life aids?

Even the fact that you are tinkering with Noise Cancellation settings … these two things (programs & settings) are what drive me to the audi countless and numerous times. So if I have the phone app, I could possibly get comfortable doing that on my own Life aids.

I had to return the Paradise Life aids (P-RL) after DROWNING them in a couple short swims, but I get to pick up the even BETTER, newer Lumity Life Aids (L-RL) on Tuesday! I can not WAIT to get them … and now I think I should look into the phone app.

Did you just download that today with the Life aids? Cuz it sounds like you were already familiar with a Phonak phone app. I’d have a bit of a learning curve.

@1Bluejay said:

sure know I’d want to use the “Remote Control” settings capabilities

As @Zebras noted, the app already works with both Paradise and Marvel. I used it with my Marvels, but the amount of things that you could control with the Marvels was more limited than what is possible on the Paradise or the Lumity. I typically found the app to be useful as a way to quickly get back to my baseline settings when I would knock the physical buttons on the aids putting on glasses or a mask. TBH I didn’t use the app much to switch between programs. But that’s why I’m curious to hear how others use the app and what kinds of custom programs they have created and why.

@1Bluejay said:

There is that long list of available programs that my audi typically sets up for me: Speech in LOUD Noise, Comfort in Echo, Acoustic Phone, so is that what you’re referring to? That you could not only select which of these programs to put in what order (Default, Program 1, 2, 3) on the Life aids?

When I connected my HAs to my app, the programs that were already set up were: automatic, restaurant, music, and TV. All but automatic I can adjust and rename. Additionally, I can have up to 10 of these programs. I assume my audiologist could have started me with different ones, but essentially yes, this allows you to create Program 1, 2, 3…10. And perhaps most importantly you can jump directly to 10 in the app without having to press the button on your HA 9 times. But with my Marvels most of the time I just let it ride in automatic.

As far as I can tell, however, you cannot make any changes to the automatic program through the app. So if you want to adjust something in that program, then you need to work with your audiologist to do that.

@ryanb said:

I have Marvels and do a fair bit of streaming through them (2-3 hours of podcasts, 0.5-1hr of calls). Battery life was never an issue when I first got them (mid 2019). Three years later I’ve started having battery life issues, where they might die around 8 or 9 pm. If I get the Lumity at some point soon I’ll be interested to see how the battery life compares.

Just as a follow up, battery life on new Lumitys (Lumities?) seems worse than battery life on new Marvels. New battery Marvels would end my day at around 40-45%, but these Lumity aids seems to be ending at closer to 25%. I haven’t gotten the “beep beep” letting me know my time is running out, but as the batteries age, my guess is that will happen with greater frequency.

@1Bluejay said:

So, if I download the Phonak phone app, would I have to re-pair and re-connect these aids (AND the new Lumity Life aids I get next week) all over again using this phone app?

You need 3 x connections. Shown in the photo. 2 x LE for the App and 1 x R for the audio.

The junior App is for kids hearing aids. It mentions what hearing aids it only works with.

When you download App, open App and follow instructions. You pair the App / hearing aids within the App.

You can change the setting in automatic which last until the aids switch to something else. But if something is really working for you, you can save that as a new program.

My programs from the audiologist:
Calm situation (which used to have a tinnitus masker on it.)
Speech in loud noise
Comfort in echo
Acoustic phone

Inherited:
Restaurant
Music
TV

I tweaked the music one for music portions of church service. For spoken parts I use the fm receiver with my Roger On.

WH