Question about UP hearing aids

It’s nice to know that it work for some people, I’m glad it work for you, because I can see how it can be great.

For me I have to keep looking for BTE hearing aids with my acrilic ear molds I have, so far I found there is Oticon, Phonak, and Bernafon near me so I will try to see if I can trial any BTE hearing aids.

@Beans said:

the feeling of sounds coming into my ear from the speaker in it was painful even when my audiologist tried to adjust it, I had like physical pain from that sounds.

Did you hear any popping or crackling when you got this pain?

Do you actually hear tones in the upper frequencies? During the audiogram do get this pain and what frequency do you get it?

Pending on how you respond to the questions advice can be given about hearing aid choices. If you can not hear in the upper frequencies there is no need to put gain into those frequencies. A less powerful hearing aid would work with frequency lowering. Sound Recover for Phonak.

Sometimes I did hear crack and staticky sound, but a lot of times I hear nothing but it was sore inside my ears, behind the eardrum if it makes sense. Also had problem that the physical earmolds was hurting me. So both was issue. The Oticon audiologist tried to change settings several times during my trial for the Intent but it didn’t help me, but I really like how more I can hear around me, compared to with Phonaks.

I get pain from higher pitches during the audiograms when they test me but I do not hear the sound of beeps, like as it gets more higher pitched I stop hearing beeps but feel pains like needle, sorry if I’m not explaining good. I do have sound recover put in my Phonaks I’m wearing now, that is what my Phonak audiologist said he put? He also tried it with my trial for Phonak Lumity UP but I didn’t hear better than my Marvels, I felt worse hearing.

@Beans said:

I get pain from higher pitches during the audiograms when they test me but I do not hear the sound of beeps, like as it gets more higher pitched I stop hearing beeps but feel pains like needle,

This is very helpful information. When we look at your audiogram a lot of us don’t see a really bad hearing issue. Something that should easily be aided with most hearing aids. But, each of us has individual hearing losses and aiding that loss can be different for each of us When your audiologist mentioned CI they did this for a good reason I would think.

My hearing did similar to yours about 10-12 years ago. It took UP hearing aids to prove I didn’t really have any hearing in the upper frequencies. At that time I used Phoank and cranked the Sound Recover pretty much all the way aggressive to bring the upper frequencies into lower hearing frequency ranges. It took time but I learned how to use this very well. Music sounded good again and my speech understanding went up.

If all this is true for you UP hearing aids are not the answer for you. Something with enough gain to power your mid and lower frequencies.

We have a few pros here on the forum that know way more than most of us. They can be very helpful if asked.

My problem isn’t my Hearing Aids, Phonak Naida Lumity 90’s, they are without a shadow of doubt, the best hearing aids, I have ever owned in thirty odd years of severe/profound loss! My issue is moulds or molds to our American cousins I also have a severe allergy to silicone, and various other things, but hard acrylic is fine, but getting a excellent fit is very challenging for my level of loss (Please check out my latest audiogram) silicone would be the most Audiologists first choice, Titanium isn’t an option, unfortunately! I believe silicone is the preferred choice, because of its density? I do not have any vents in my moulds, I also use twin walled tubing for extra gain! “Silicone Hypoallergenic moulds” work up to a point, but the nano coating eventually wears out, and a reaction will occur… Gold Plated Silicon Moulds at £210 each, are also an obvious alternative, and my Audiologist is at present consulting Starkey Mould Lab UK on a workable solution, in the meantime I have ordered a set of “Clear Hard Acrylic Skeleton BTE Moulds” in the fond hope we get an excellent fit, and then order the Gold Silicon from the same impression… Naida Lumity’s are indeed excellent hearing aids, they have also got excellent Bluetooth connectivity, but there should be something in the UP horizon shortly, if previous irritations are anything to go by? Perhaps a Naida Sphere??? Good luck, cheers Kev

Thank you. I will do that. I have to make a new appointment soon.

That is interesting, I only use hard earmolds, I tried soft silicon before but it was not comfortable. I guess I can try see if there is any new Phonak in my country that I could try again, though I am not fan of it because I keep hearing nothing behind or around me with Phonaks even after I had 3 different places adjusting and changing them, and was struggling too much for understanding speech.

Like all major hearing aid manufacturers… Phonak hearing aids utilize a sophisticated suite of signal processing features and algorithms, many powered by artificial intelligence (AI) and machine learning (ML), which operate under the primary operating system, your audiologist will choose one of these fitting formula’s he or she think are best suited to your loss? The NAL-NL2 fitting formula is, just one of these many formulas… Copy paste below explains what it is… National Acoustic Lab, I thought it was Australian Lab, apologies…

a complex, algorithm-based system for programming hearing aids, not a single equation

. Developed by the National Acoustic Laboratories (NAL), it uses an adaptive computer-controlled process to maximize speech intelligibility while keeping overall loudness comfortable for the user, similar to the perception of someone with normal hearing. The specific gain prescribed is calculated by an algorithm that takes into account the individual’s audiogram, and adjustments are made for factors like gender, binaural vs. unilateral use, and experience level.

How the formula works

• Core goal: To make speech clear and to keep the overall volume comfortable, never exceeding a normal-hearing person’s perception.

• Method: It uses a combination of a speech intelligibility model and a loudness model in an adaptive computer-controlled optimization process.

• Output: The formula calculates the appropriate hearing aid settings, which often means more gain in the low and high frequencies and less through the mid-frequency range, to improve speech clarity without making sounds uncomfortably loud.

How the formula is applied

• Audiogram input: The user’s hearing test results (audiogram) are the primary input for the calculation.

• User-specific adjustments: The formula then makes adjustments based on other user attributes:

  • Gender

  • Aid configuration (whether one or both ears are fitted)

  • Experience with amplification

• Compression ratio adjustments: It also includes adjustments for the type of compression used in the hearing aid, especially for severe to profound hearing loss, to account for different user preferences based on whether the compression is fast or slow-acting.

Another is…

Sound Quality and Audibility Algorithms

• APD 3.0 (Automatic Phonak Digital): The fitting formula used in the Phonak Target software to calculate the appropriate gain and output for a patient’s specific hearing loss, aiming for instant comfort and optimal audibility.

Cheers Kev

Thank you so much for explaining this! I think it makes a bit more sense to me now. I am struggling with my current Phonaks and when I trialed the Phonak Lumity UP, it actually felt worse than my old Marvels, maybe it is fitting formula just not working well for my ears? My parents called an audiologist near me and they suggest to me to trial Bernafon Leox and Oticon Xceed next, I don’t know much about these hearing aids. There is no Phonak near me since I moved country. I will try to ask the audiologist about the NAL NL2 also. Thank you

You are very welcome @Beans hopefully you will find a suitable solution… For me, and most folks within the severe/profound thresholds, in my opinion at least 4 things must align, # 1, is a good competent, and experienced Audiologist, whom is capable of the best optimum set up, of your hearing aids. # 2, Good custom BTE moulds. # 3, a Good quality BTE UP set of Bluetooth hearing aids, most of the top 5 hearing aid manufacturers produce these, but some are outdated or old tech… # 4, the correct choice of fitting formula, after the initial programming! If you are fortunate to align with all 4, you should get an excellent fit… but if any aspect of the 4 above are missing, your experience could be disappointing, and in some instances disastrous, the Audiologist is key to the whole experience… Good Luck, cheers Kev

Thank you I will pass this on to my audiologists when I manage to arrange trial for hearing aids. I’m not sure I understand all of it myself.

Since you seem to have lots knowledge, do you maybe know anything about Oticon Xceed or Bernafon Leox hearing aids? This two I was suggested by one audiologist over the phone and the IRL specialist who did my audiogram. Sorry if I am bothering with all my questions!

@Beans said:

Bernafon Leox hearing aids

Not a problem @Beans I have no knowledge of these aids, I believe, I have heard of them, but that’s about it! You would have to research them, the problem with the Oticon Xceed is they are much older technology, 6 years old, things have moved on since then, 6 years is an extremely long time in hearing aid development! I have worn Oticon in the past, but Phonak has always been my preferred brand, perhaps I just prefer their sound? Oticon do make exceptional hearing aids, but for me, 6 year old tech is a big turnoff…Cheers Kev

Okies, thank you, I will do some googling! Thank you for all your help

HOnestly unable to answer fully because with out word understanding there is no way to know which would work best You show very high SRT’s especially for the left which would suggest poor word recognition. It also doesn’t show how you understand at comfort lever with each or with both together. Its possible your left will actually make binaural understanding worse than better. personally I would want more information.

And Yes Oticon makes Xceed BTE’s which I fit often and have very good luck with