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Phonak Audeo Yes, Q90 experience and issues

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Hello Everyone,

I apologize in advance for the long post but I have been through a terrible experience which I am hoping someone can shed some light on.

I was fitted with Phonak Audéo Yes 5 years ago in my right ear which was a great experience, the aid went under warranty couple of times though and was replaced once, several months back I started experiencing a sudden death issues where the aid would suddenly switch off and I would have to open then close the battery compartment and fiddle with the cable for it to start back on, this was getting worse, I ordered a new speaker and sent it for maintenance but the issue came back shortly and I decided it was time to replace the aid.

6 months ago, I was fitted with a dual Phonak Audéo Q90 and a ComPilot which cost me a fortune, I was initially so happy and excited as it was my first time to experience the benefits of having wireless aids in both ears.

The aids were going fine for several weeks till I started to experience the same issue that I was having with the Audéo Yes, this time it was much worse and progressed dramatically in a very short time, it only happened in the right ear first, I was provided with a temporary replacement while sending it back to Phonak, it was Christmas time so it took a while however, the replacement aid was working perfectly for several days then started doing the same issue, finally Phonak decided to replace my aid with a brand new one which has also started experiencing same issue after couple of weeks with slightly less severity.

It has lately started to happen to the left aid as well, but less frequently.

I am wondering if anyone has experienced similar issues with aids, whether Phonak or another brand, as I am currently advised to go back to a Naida CRTs which I don’t believe would solve the problem as I believe there is something to do with the RTE structure, or wire connection etc…

Any advice?

Below are extracts from emails exchanged between myself, my Audiologist and Phonak that describes the issue and the responses I got.

Me:
I will try to describe the issue as much as possible.

Basically what’s happening is that with simple movements like putting on my shades (arms touches the hearing aid), or combing my hair, etc… the hearing aid switches itself off, at the beginning all I need to do is turn it off and back on again by opening/closing the battery compartment, but gradually the sensitivity and the rate at which the occurs starts to dramatically increase over time and can be triggered from as simple as turning my head or just laughing or chewing, and the usual fix of turning off and back on becomes less effective, I then have to mess around with the wire connection at the top of the hearing aid by either touching it or trying to push it slightly towards the aid before it comes back on, as the issue starts worsening over time, sometimes it can come back on easily, and some other times it’s pain to get it to switch back on then I have to start being extra careful with any movement that involves my head or interferes with the aid.

One more thing that I have noticed which occurs after such behavior is that the battery life becomes affected, and the aid tends to give false “Low battery alarms” where it beeps and the aid dies pretty quicker than usual but when I switch it off for a minute or two and back on, it can last another couple of days without replacing the battery!

Now the only thing I can think of that I do more with my right aid and not the left one is that I tend to take it off more frequently during the day to speak on the phone if not using the Compilot or I may put the phone on my right ear as I never use my left ear for phone calls.

I suspect that there may be design flaw of this model being extra sensitive with its tiny wire connection and eventually starts failing, have you had any similar issues with another patient using these aids.

Phonak’s Reply:
Just from the description I would say that moisture is building up in the receiver grill and then probably in the receiver itself.
This is verified by the service report of moisture (sweat) and the electronics, housing and receiver having to be replaced so moisture has also affected the battery contacts and amplifier as well.
Is your client using a drying aid kit when the device is not being worn?
I don’t agree that the design is faulty but rather cosmetic demand for the miniaturization of the device has required that compromises have had to be made for the restriction of moisture ingress. Also the fact that the receiver is worn in the ear canal means that it will be susceptible to moisture issues. I doubt that this is restricted to Phonak RIC devices and would be the same for Custom devices as well.
If moisture protection is required then by default the hearing instruments are larger to allow more protection elements to be built in.
I hope this helps.

Me:
Thank you for keeping me informed of this, please see my comments below

  • I never used a drying kit, I don't have a problem using one if it help protects the aids, maybe it should be provided or recommended if the aids are such sensitive/prone to moisture.
  • I had an Audeo YES which was of a similar size and design (RIC) for years with no issues, I only started experiencing problems after 3+ years of use not within weeks, so I may argue that size has much to do with it as mentioned unless further compromises for moisture ingress were introduced in the Q range.
  • As I have mentioned in my follow-up email, I have tried replacing the speaker with a different one that was almost new which didn't fix the problem.

I have then purchased a Cedis SanDryPremium along with the new replacement, then few weeks later:

Me:
I regret to inform you that the hearing aid started to experience the same issue once again yesterday, I have done all the following:

  • [FONT=Verdana]I have been placing the aids every night in the dryer as per instructions
  • I have dramatically decreased the number of times I take it off during the day and I would either use the Compilot or place the phone over the aid microphone
  • I was extra gentle while taking the aid off and careful not to pull it from the wire
[/FONT]I believe this eliminates the moisture issue and I could have saved the $$$. Audiologist: I really don’t know what to tell you, especially since the same problem is occurring with a brand new instrument. All I can suggest is that I ask Phonak if they will swap the Audeo aids for the Naida CRTs which are slightly larger and dust & waterproof. Like you, I doubt it is a moisture problem. Let me know if you have a suggestion.

Any input or suggestions would be appreciated :confused:

Cheers,
Remon

7 people in this conversation12 min readJump to latest

Have you thought about getting a Dry n Store, they seem to be the best out there at reducing moisture problems.

What you described does sound like moisture problems from experience.

This could be a wax issue. How often do you change the WaxTrap on the receivers? You might want to replace them more often and see if that helps.

If it’s a moisture-in-the-receiver issue, switching to the Naida will make no difference. It uses the same receivers as the Audéo. Maybe you can get the Bolero with a SlimTube instead.

In reply to @Zebras

Thanks for your reply Zebras, as I have mentioned in my post, I already purchased the Cedis SanDryPremium that was recommended by my audiologist and have been using it since getting the new replacement aid, do you think the Dry n Store would be better or have an advantage over this one?

rasmus I doubt it’s a wax issue, I replace often, sometimes once a week or whenever I detect a slight change in sound, I am aware of the sound block that can occur due to wax and I have also tried taking the wax guard off altogether to see if it was the cause, which is not.

I would like to mention that with the previous aid when the issue was so severe and sensitive to the least movement, sometimes just tapping the aid with my finger couple of times would get it to switch itself back on again without taking it off or opening the battery compartment and closing it again.

I think the main question here is: Does the moisture in the speaker results in the aid actually shutting itself down or restarting as a measure of protection? The aid does shut down and I can hear the starting beeps when it turns back on again even without switching it off when I just move my head, gently tap it couple of times or fuddle with the connection of the wire at the top of the aid which seems to have like 1mm looseness!

I believe replacement with Naida wouldn’t solve the problem either, and I also wouldn’t like to go back to a tube as it makes a big difference for me in terms of the sound quality.

Edited

Remon,
If it’s not a moisture or wax issue then it’s either something in the ’s themselves or possibly a bad battery connection. I would try getting a different brand of batteries and see if the problem persists. Good luck!

@seb said:

Remon,
If it’s not a moisture or wax issue then it’s either something in the HA’s themselves or possibly a bad battery connection. I would try getting a different brand of batteries and see if the problem persists. Good luck!

Brilliant, I had already tried different battery brands but I haven’t thought of the connection, which makes sense as I tend to switch the aid off and back on many times during the day which seems to have weakened the connection.
I opened the battery compartment, pushed the connectors using a small tool to slightly bend them towards the battery and voila, seems to have fixed the problem!!

I don’t want to be overexcited but I will update the thread in a few days after I see how it goes!

@Remon said:

Brilliant, I had already tried different battery brands but I haven’t thought of the connection, which makes sense as I tend to switch the aid off and back on many times during the day which seems to have weakened the connection.
I opened the battery compartment, pushed the connectors using a small tool to slightly bend them towards the battery and voila, seems to have fixed the problem!!

I don’t want to be overexcited but I will update the thread in a few days after I see how it goes!

I hope it finally solves the problem.

@seb said:

I hope it finally solves the problem.

Seb, You’re a legend!

I would like to confirm that it was definitely the battery connection, I haven’t had a single incident for almost 3 days, not to mention that I have played squash for 2 hours without issues which would have been impossible without the aid turning off every few minutes due to movement.

Thanks a lot!

In reply to @Remon

@Remon said:

Brilliant, I had already tried different battery brands but I haven’t thought of the connection, which makes sense as I tend to switch the aid off and back on many times during the day which seems to have weakened the connection.
I opened the battery compartment, pushed the connectors using a small tool to slightly bend them towards the battery and voila, seems to have fixed the problem!!

I don’t want to be overexcited but I will update the thread in a few days after I see how it goes!

Maybe this is a warning that you shouldn’t be turning your off so many times in a day. Why don’t you use a phone another way? If you really need to continue to take your HA off many times in a day, then think about getting a mute program. I see it a bit worrying that you have a brand new HA but you are already having trouble with it because you turn it on and off so many times in a day.

Like Zebra says, get a mute program onboard or see if your compilot has an onboard mute or standby mode. This saves a ton of wear and tear on the battery compartment and has the added bonus of instant service without waiting for your to turn on.

@Zebras said:

Maybe this is a warning that you shouldn’t be turning your HA off so many times in a day. Why don’t you use a phone another way? If you really need to continue to take your HA off many times in a day, then think about getting a mute program. I see it a bit worrying that you have a brand new HA but you are already having trouble with it because you turn it on and off so many times in a day.

The reason I take the off is because ComPilot is not suitable for all situations, in many circumstances the other party is complaining of a loud noise or unclear sound, Also when I try to use the phone directly on the aid I have trouble centering the speaker on the microphone and with slightest movement I simply hear nothing, I was using my previous “Audeo Yes” in the same way for more than 3 years without incident while it took less than a week with the new HA.

@moccasin said:

Like Zebra says, get a mute program onboard or see if your compilot has an onboard mute or standby mode. This saves a ton of wear and tear on the battery compartment and has the added bonus of instant service without waiting for your HAs to turn on.

I don’t currently have a mute program on my ComPilot or myPilot but I will be requesting it on my next appointment with my Audi.

Thanks for all the help and useful tips!

In reply to @moccasin

Thank you Remon for this thread.
You describe my current experience precisely.
My Phonak Audéo aids are currently with Phonak for testing and I am using some temporary Phonk aids, which exhibit the same problem.

I do use a drying devise almost evry night, I don’t take the aids out frequently (except to try and reactivate after they stop working), so it does appear to be a design fault. I am wondering how many others are experiencing similar issues.

I am a long time hearing aid user and have always treated my aids with great care. I have never experienced significant problems previously. I have also had the right aid receiver come off (in my ear) and the left aid receiver failed and had to be replaced. These aids are only about a year old and it has been a disappointing experience. The frequent and unpredictable switching off is very frustrating. By opening and closing the battery lid they will eventually kick in again, but not always quickly. Needless to say, they switch off at incredibly inconvenient times.

I will repost after I receive the aids back from Phonak.

Ji

In reply to @seasonedears

@seasonedears said:

Remon,

The solution to other people complaining about noise, when you use the Compilot microphone is here: http://www.amazon.com/Phonak-External-Lapel-Microphone-Pilot/dp/B00BJOF93O. The $27 Compilot lapel mic will solve the problem. I had the same problem, but the MC1 microphone works great. It is also handy when you wear the compilot under clothes. I use it all the time.

Thanks for this!, I wasn’t aware of the Lapel Mic!, it’s now USD $29.99 + shipping so I’ll check with my Audi first to see if it’s available in Australia before proceeding with the purchase.

@Ji_Utso said:

Thank you Remon for this thread.
You describe my current experience precisely.
My Phonak Audéo aids are currently with Phonak for testing and I am using some temporary Phonk aids, which exhibit the same problem.

I do use a drying devise almost evry night, I don’t take the aids out frequently (except to try and reactivate after they stop working), so it does appear to be a design fault. I am wondering how many others are experiencing similar issues.

Ji

I was quite confident it wouldn’t be just me having these problems and I agree there is some design flaw in here, I have been a hearing aid user for over 10 years and never had such inconvenience, it was driving me crazy!

Are you by any chance using Energizer 312? It seemed to occur slightly more frequently when I use these versus the PowerOne Ultra probably the latter might be a tad thicker.

I would suggest you let your Audiologist know about the battery connection issue described here, I have also reported the issue to Phonak Australia through my Audiologist.
Let us know how you go with the replacement

Best of luck!

I was quite confident it wouldn’t be just me having these problems and I agree there is some design flaw in here, I have been a hearing aid user for over 10 years and never had such inconvenience, it was driving me crazy!

Are you by any chance using Energizer 312? It seemed to occur slightly more frequently when I use these versus the PowerOne Ultra probably the latter might be a tad thicker.

I would suggest you let your Audiologist know about the battery connection issue described here, I have also reported the issue to Phonak Australia through my Audiologist.

I have used a range of batterires but more recently yes, Energizer 312 almost exclusively. It is possible the problem has become worse during this period. Also, having to open and close the battery door frequently probably exacerbates the problem. I will try alternative batteries to see if this makes a difference.

My aids have been returner by Phonak and are currenlty working fine. They did not mention that anyone else had had similar experiences. I have provided my Audio with a copy of your original post and it has been passed to Phonak.

It was very reassuring to have your post available - assured me I was not going fully mad!

Regards

@Ji_Utso said:

I have used a range of batterires but more recently yes, Energizer 312 almost exclusively. It is possible the problem has become worse during this period. Also, having to open and close the battery door frequently probably exacerbates the problem. I will try alternative batteries to see if this makes a difference.
Regards

It would seem the battery brand may have played a role!, I had an appointment with my Audiologist today and he confirmed he had set-up several other patients with the same aid without issues however they would most likely be using batteries purchased through the clinic only.

Good luck with your returned aids! hopefully the madness would stop :slight_smile:

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