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Please clarify: Bluetooth versus(?) MFi

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I’ve been wearing Phonak Audéo V90 for three years. I have some unhappiness with my hearing, which may or may not be improvable with a different aid. (My impression is that the technology hasn’t changed much since 2015.) However, regardless, I would very much like direct-to- from my iPhone 6s and from my entertainment system receiver (audio component). So my intention is to try out a new pair on the basis that if I don’t think they’re worth the $ to upgrade, I won’t have to – e.g., via Hearing Revolution.

I’m unclear about what Apple is with respect to Bluetooth. Do I need MFi-compatible HAs or merely Bluetooth-compatible? For example, would both Signia Pure 312 7Nx (MFi) and Phonak Audéo B-Direct (Bluetooth) both work with the iPhone? Any operational differences? Any reason my Sony audio component (Bluetooth 4.1) wouldn’t work with either of them?

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MFI ’s will work with iphone.
Bluetooth (4.2) will work in mono from any bluetooth-capable phone to the B-Direct.
You would need an intermediate device that can speak to the aids to send other audio in either case.

Edited

The hearing aids use a proprietary process to stream from an iPhone. Regular Bluetooth transmitters will not stream directly to the hearing aids. However, every manufacturer has their own Bluetooth device to allow connection from cell phones and Bluetooth transmitters.

For example, I have a Costco Kirkland Signature 8.0 hearing aids (you will see it referred to here as KS8) and I have the small Bluetooth device for my hearing aids, which I wear on a lanyard, under my shirt
You can also clip it to clothing.

Besides my cell phone, I have my office phone, laptops, tablets, and generic Bluetooth transmitters connected to my hearing aids. I want everything going through my hearing aids, and this is the way, with the Bluetooth device for my hearing aids.

My hearing aids, the KS8.0 are really the Signia nx 312 so my Bluetooth device is similar to the Streamline Mic.

@brec said:

Any reason my Sony audio component (Bluetooth 4.1) wouldn’t work with either of them?

It wouldn’t work with the aids because the aids do Low Energy only and in a proprietary format. It wouldn’t work with the Phonak because the Phonak doesn’t do A2DP (the standard Bluetooth Classic audio profile).

You mentioned the Phonak b-direct and I believe that is the only model that will connect directly to bluetooth transmitters but I’m not familiar with it and can’t comment on its capabilities, performance, or limitations. I can tell you my setup, with the intermediate Bluetooth device works well.

To learn which hearing aids are (made for iPhone) do a quick search for the list here or on Apple’s website. MFi aids connect directly with compatible iOS devices eg. iPad, iPhone or iPod. They use Bluetooth LE(low energy). The Audeo B Direct connect via the old stand Bluetooth 4.2. to mobile phones. Most Hearing aids have a device which acts as an intermediary and can allow them to connect via that device to various standard Bluetooth devices. You do need to check the lowest version of Bluetooth the device supports and the version of Bluetooth your other products use to check likely compatability.

Yes - for mobile phone calls only - does not actually need to be a smart phone - just the required Bluetooth.

Hi, new here, first post, but this is a topic I am very interested in. Have Phonak Naidas from 2012, and know it’s time to get new , but am on Android, and carry a Pixel 2, so I feel like I need to wait just a smidge longer until the Android P update gives some clarity as to what it means by “works with hearing aids” and whether manufacturers have to do some updates or if HAs will now just work with Android P.

In reply to #10

Thanks! I think I’d prefer phone listening at the expense of having to use the phone or a lanyard device as a mic.

Because of price, I’m planning to start by going to Costco to check out the KS8. They’re 45% of the price of, say, the Signia 312 7Nx via Hearing Revolution.

In reply to @d_Wooluf

@d_Wooluf said:

Any reason my Sony audio component (Bluetooth 4.1) wouldn’t work with either of them?

It wouldn’t work with the MFi aids because the aids do Low Energy only and in a proprietary format. It wouldn’t work with the Phonak because the Phonak doesn’t do A2DP (the standard Bluetooth Classic audio profile).

Hmm, thanks. Anyone know whether the Costco KS8 has an accessory that can stream to them them from the Sony receiver, using some receiver connection (maybe plug-in?). Motivation: I understand most speech, but most is not enough, so I use the on-screen CC for TV series programs. Maybe in-ear would help?

Edited

In reply to @dcjd

I don’t think it is likely that Android will be able to implement Apple’s proprietary software for sending audio packets through . There is not an audio standard for BLE (haven’t checked on that lately) so each company or consortium is on their own.

My take on it is, it will be possible for Android companies to do something, and they may get together on that, but there is no guarantee they will. If they don’t get together then hearing aid manufacturers would have to pick a scheme, similar to how they did with iphone. They would offer and MF-Samsung, or MFi and MF-Nexus, etc. It would be great to just have two standards, MFi and MF-Android, but not getting my hopes up. Maybe for the next product cycle (2-3 years).

Edited

In reply to @brec

Yes, every manufacturer has a Bluetooth device that works with their hearing aids to allow cell phone use and streaming from Bluetooth transmitters for laptops, tablets, sound systems, etc. For the KS8.0 it is called the Rexton Smart Mic. It actually says Connexx Smart Mic on the back of mine.

It is strictly Bluetooth, no wired connection so you would have to add a Bluetooth transmitter to the sound system, which is very easy. The Smart Mic will pair to up to 8 devices. I haven’t quite hit the limit yet.

Two bits of advice, if you are adding Bluetooth to a video producing device, TV or laptop, get the Bluetooth transmitters made for tv, as they will have less latency and sound will match up with lips.

When pairing, and then also when connecting, make sure no other Bluetooth device in range is on.

@Don said:

Two bits of advice, if you are adding Bluetooth to a video producing device, TV or laptop, get the Bluetooth transmitters made for tv, as they will have less latency and sound will match up with lips.

Here’s what my Sony STRDN1080 user guide says:

[112] Using BLUETOOTH Features Listening with BLUETOOTH receiver (headphones/speakers)
Compatible BLUETOOTH version and profiles
“Profile” refers to a standard set of capabilities for various BLUETOOTH product capabilities. This receiver supports the following BLUETOOTH version and profiles:
Compatible BLUETOOTH version: BLUETOOTH Specification Version 4.1
Compatible BLUETOOTH profiles:
A2DP 1.2 (Advanced Audio Distribution Profile): Receives high-quality audio content.
AVRCP 1.5 (Audio Video Remote Control Profile): Controls audio/video devices (pausing, stopping, starting playback, volume control, etc.) (*)
*Absolute volume is supported only when [Bluetooth Mode] is set to [Receiver]. When [Bluetooth Mode] is set to [Transmitter], volume command for AVRCP 1.3 is supported.

In reply to @Don

@Don said:

My take on it is, it will be possible for Android companies to do something, and they may get together on that, but there is no guarantee they will. If they don’t get together then hearing aid manufacturers would have to pick a scheme, similar to how they did with iphone.

I think they’ll wait for the audio standard and the hearing aid standard to be released. There are too many potential advantages to it. If they were to start work on their own protocol now, it might not even get out before the Bluetooth SIG standards are released.

BT5 is released. Some phone are advertising it. It means they have hardware capable of supporting it. But hardware is only fully or partially used by software. It takes both to provide each service and that is especially true for audio.

Think drivers in a traditional computer. You can get driver updates that add or improve features. When you buy a new peripheral, it often comes with a CD to add the driver.

The problem with Android is that vendors offer limited upgrades/drivers. Google’s Nexus phone are stock Android and will have more upgrades over their life. It is the best gamble on getting support at some future date.

In reply to @dcjd

I am an android guy, using KS8 hearing aids. I am therefore following the - like feature which is supposed to be coming out android phones by the end of 2018. From what I understand this is a Bluetooth 5.x protocol. I’m using a Samsung Galaxy S8+ phone which has a Snapdragon processor. I’m hoping this interface happens soon because I love using my hearing aids with my iPad. The sound quality is exceptional!

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