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Phonak introduces Marvel platform and Audéo M hearing aids

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In reply to @lordshivay

@lordshivay said:

It really worries me to hear the Marvels does not support multipoint pairing. It is also not wise they do not support the MFI program. In this matter Resound and Oticon does a better job.

I partially agree, in that connecting to multiple devices would make it much more useful. It does connect to iPhone as a normal headset and since Phonak has shown that general Bluetooth direct connections will work, I think all the research dollars at other companies will go toward meeting that, and will be obsolete. There is no need for it if you have direct Bluetooth connections that provide true hands free operation.

Well I have found something interesting about MFI as compaired to the direct Bluetooth connection. My OPN will stay connected to the IPhone using MFI at a greater distance that the Bluetooth will. I have seen it due to my connect clip being Bluetooth and my aids are MFI I have connected both to my IPhone at the same time and my connect clip disconnects before my hearing aids disconnect. The difference is a good 15 to 20 feet.

I wonder if this is because the MFI is Bluetooth Low Energy and whatever protocol in there that enables the lower energy consumption also promotes longer range.

In reply to @cvkemp

I have been around high and low power radio as a hobby my whole life. As far as comparing mfi and Bluetooth, I would suggest that your test only applies to your Oticon. A true test would require identical power and identical antennas, as I believe that the frequency both being 2.4ghz, would not be a factor. Also the type of modulation could have an effect, but in this case less likely. My experience has been mainly hf thru uhf, but both digital and analog, including CW.

Well also I get my calls streamed to both hearing aids, and not just one. With my hearing loss just getting to hear a call in one ear is the same as not hearing a call at all. I am not sure what is best or worse, all I know is it works for me and that is really all that is important.
I do not really care what the brand of hearing aids is either, I have no real brand royalty only that it works and does what I need and can use.
I use to be someone that would not use anything but Microsoft and Dell. Then I went to work for both and came to realize they too have warts. Yes I do use Apple at this time, but only because when my Audi placed me in to Oticon hearing aids and at the time the streamer only worked with the IPhone and I had to have the streamer to continue my job as I was on the phone all day everyday and getting a call in to one ear was not working for me. So I got a Iphone and found just how easy it was to use, and just how it worked much longer than other hardware and the more the IOS changed the more it countinued to work the same way. And I also love the fact reguardless if I am on my Iphone, IPad, or computer and a call comes in I can take it very semiless just as if I was on only my Iphone. I am retired and I only want to deal with my hobbies now and not worry if my phone is going to work or if my computer is going to work and how I can get the to work together. You may not like Apple and that is okay with me. For the longest time I was the same way.

In reply to @Volusiano

Check me but my understanding is that is NOT standard Bluetooth Low Energy. However, Apple jumped the gun and produced their own proprietary interface ahead of the Bluetooth Standard. Nor is the Marvel Bluetooth Low Energy but at least it is a standard Bluetooth but may consume more energy than the Bluetooth Low Energy. Apple historically goes their own way in many cases.

I don’t believe I said that MFI is STANDARD Bluetooth Low Energy. I only said that MFI is Bluetooth Low Energy.

It is Bluetooth for sure because if you don’t have Bluetooth enabled, you won’t get MFI to work.

It’s low energy for sure, because otherwise you would have needed an intermediary streaming device like with Android (except for the Marvel models).

So MFI IS Bluetooth Low Energy alright. It’s just that it’s a proprietary version of that Apple implemented on their own so they didn’t have to wait for any standard BLE to become available.

Sounds like what I said holds. Sorry, not trying to drum up an Apple vs Android discussion. Agreed is low energy.

Edited

In reply to @Don

Please read back the discussion, seems you don’t understand the issue here, there is a huge difference between pairing and connecting. Don’t want to rephrase again what the difference is… as it is clearly explained many times in this threat before.
Second remark mfi become obsolete… no-one can look in the future, though here you also need to understand what mfi is, it is a firm integration towards the apple platform, so firm and succesfull google creates a mfa platform as well. Apple will not drop it without proper replacement, why should they, it protects their investments and it benefits to their MFI partners (such as resound/oticon/widex and many other non manufacters as well).
For us as users Mfi is great, because it gives more control on top of standarisation such as bluetooth that enable multipoint pairing features. Therefor it is such a shame Phonak does not comply to MFI and implement obsolete standards (version 4.2).

Edited

In reply to @Volusiano

Not true is in the bluetooth spec since 4.0 , and MFI use the bluetooth spec and more to further integrate any devices functions deep into the IOS operating system.
Fact that Iphone XS and Marvel does not work prove Phonak poorly implemented the Bluetooth spec since Apple XS support BT5.0 and this version is fully backwards compatible. Phonak claims they do native bluetooth 4.2, though have (had) issues with XS, this and the fact they do not suport multipoint pairing prove they are great developers in algoriths and have poor knowledge on bluetooth wireless technology. Good news is it can be fixed in their firmware

iPhone XS DOES now work with the Marvel platform. Your Audi will need to update the firmware and select “fixed” in Target. It all works and is brilliant!

never said they are poor hearing aids, my best friend just got them and loves them. And all he has is his simple smartphone that does connect to the aids. He is happy that he can finally hear his grandkids over the phone. I think it is great.
But I still have too many things I connect to on almost daily, and see the forgetting and pairing process a huge pain.
But we all have to understand that hearing aids are really mean just to hear better, and it seems that the companies are understanding that the cell phone is the way people communicate. What I would like to see is a good old flip phone with bluetooth that all of the aids could connect too.

In reply to @lordshivay

@lordshivay said:

Therefor it is such a shame Phonak does not comply to MFI and implement obsolete BT standards (version 4.2).

If the Marvels were restricted to MFI, none of us Android users (or for that matter even bluetooth-enabled dumb phones) could have these wonderful hearing aids. There are a few people who don’t use iPhones! :slight_smile:

As a long-time Android user (Samsung Note 9 now), I’ve been waiting for these for years. Phonak is the first to leverage this tech and for the first time now I have direct Bluetooth calling (without some clunky intermediate clip that requires separate charging) and beautiful stereo streaming. I am grateful Phonak finally released these jewels.

Maybe Phonak will release some MFI-only Marvels for iPhone users, who knows…

Just for the record, I just transferred my Marvel pairing from my iPhone XS to my iPad. It took one minute flat. Most of that was waiting for the devices to wake up, and the to reboot for pairing. I leave the app connection on the phone alone.
Step 1: forget the connected marvel on the phone
Step 2: temporarily disable Bluetooth on the phone (may be overkill)
Step,3: put iPad in pairing mode
Step 4: power cycle HA for pairing
Step 5: connect when prompted
Step 6: re enable Bluetooth on phone
Works smoothly every time. Admittedly a pia, but easily done in one minute. A small price to pay for the streaming quality. Hopefully soon improved by Phonak.

Edited

In reply to @jelks.cabaniss

@jelks.cabaniss said:

If the Marvels were restricted to MFI, none of us Android users (or for that matter even bluetooth-enabled dumb phones) could have these wonderful hearing aids. There are a few people who don’t use iPhones! :slight_smile:

A few? Android market-share is now more than 80%. That’s more than just a few! :sunglasses:

@jelks.cabaniss said:

As a long-time Android user (Samsung Note 9 now), I’ve been waiting for these for years. Phonak is the first to leverage this tech and for the first time now I have direct Bluetooth calling (without some clunky intermediate clip that requires separate charging) and beautiful stereo streaming. I am grateful Phonak finally released these jewels.

I’m a Google Pixel 3 XL user and for me the Marvels are an absolute dream come true!

@jelks.cabaniss said:

Maybe Phonak will release some MFI-only Marvels for iPhone users, who knows…

Speaking for the 80% Android market-share, who cares? :blush: In actuality though, if an iPhone user wants to use Marvels, Bluetooth Classic works the same way as it does for Android.

When Phonak decides to make Bluetooth Classic work the way it should, making it easy to move between different devices, all the bases will be covered. And it can be done easily with nothing more than a firmware update! :sunglasses:

In reply to @TraderGary

@TraderGary said:

Android market-share is now more than 80%.

I think that’s a world-wide figure. Apple market share in the U.S. is much higher and amongst users, because of MFI, it’s something like a 3:1 ratio of Apple users vs. Android.

The following suggests that iOS has at least a 50% market share, if not a 60% market share in the U.S. based on browsing statistics (and the U.S. market share seems to be increasing slightly, not decreasing). Probably can find different statistics depending on source and method of generation.

image

Android v iOS market share 20193

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