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Phonak introduces Marvel platform and Audéo M hearing aids

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In reply to @wfnorton

@wfnorton said:

Auto Sense 3.0 (Not sure how this will work? Have not seen any technical articles describing the way this works. Can anyone help on this topic?)

If I recall correctly, Dr. Cliff’s YouTube review of the Marvel is BIG on Autosense 3.0. He says it’s going to be the killer feature of the Marvel and make it standout from the crowd. At 9 min 27 sec into his review, he starts discussing what it does and how. Dr. Cliff’s Phonak Marvel YouTube Review70

In reply to @Junkyard

@Junkyard said:

This means the new phonak marvel are upgradeble like the Unitrons?

I’ve been told yes.

Unitron just picked up Phonak’s Sound Recover 2 for their power and Roger receivers integrated into the battery doors, so there’s been some swapping.

In reply to @jim_lewis

I am a bit sceptical about this. There is no basis for this other than he was a fan of the Autosense 2.0. Apparently 3.0 was designed by but I did not hear Dr Cliff mention this or any other substantial feature that will make it a killer. Hopefully I am proved wrong over time.

Manufacturers have been using to categorize environments and attempt to dial in their automatic switching for a while now. Phonak is probably just marketting it now in response to Widex’s Evoke marketting (and perhaps a growing public understanding of machine learning). That’s not to say that hearing aids aren’t getting better at making these decisions.

Phonak/Unitron do tend to be ahead of the game in terms of automatic switching. Or they are just better at communicating what their hearing aids are actually doing.

Does anyone know or have ideas?! Will the RogerDirect be the same as the current Roger System so future transmitters will work with older receivers?

I have Roger 10s but don’t plan to upgrade my anytime soon but would like a new transmitter as they come out.

In reply to @wfnorton

I’ve been wearing my Audeo B-Direct aids for just over a year. While I won’t be eligible for any trade-in (D R A T) I am definitely going to pursue getting these new Marvel aids - most likely the size 13-battery model. It seems the overall shorter battery life may be an ISSUE (and I have no plans to get the rechargeable version), but even so, the advantages of this new Marvel far outweigh any downsides as far as I can tell.

Would I LOVE to come back here and crow about their success!

Hello 1Bluejay. I noticed that Dr. Cliff, , in his youtube video had mentioned that he had the Marvel M-312 (battery 312 size) for a week to try out and all. So I asked him and he answered my questions related to 312 battery life expectations for the Marvel. He said that he would expect a heavy user of steaming might get 3 days of use on a set of batteries while a light duty streamer might get 6-7 days. That range may vary he said if you have a more pronounced hearing loss and need more boost on the in ear speakers.

Anyway, I too am not a fan of rechargeable yet. I need a more reliable power source than a battery that may drain too early if I wake and 0600 and stream a lot. Don’t want my aid to drop offline at dinner time.

I plan to go with the Marvel M-312.

Just fantasizing. Is it possible that these hearing aids could be BT5 compliant and offer better energy efficiency when used with a phone with BT5? I’m pretty sure BT5 is backwards compatible so seems feasible to my simple mind.

@MDB said:

Is it possible that these hearing aids could be BT5 compliant and offer better energy efficiency when used with a phone with BT5?

I’ve been wondering that, too. It would seem crazy when ReSound has just offered an that promised 5.0 MFA compatibility to come out with an HA that can’t offer that down the line and has a comparatively poorer battery life, at least for the rechargeables (only 4 hours of streaming to give a 16-hour battery life vs. 12 hours of streaming with ReSound rechargeable to give a 24-hour battery life). But you’d think if they built BT 5.0 compatibility in, they’d crow about it, too.

Does Resound for sure offer BT5? I hadn’t seen that. I just knew it was a Google/Resound collaboration and I thought it was 4.2.

Edited

In reply to @Neville

that means is just another name of auto switching? stil AI cant solve all problem and can not be accurate all time.
my signia when i wear with headphone it detecting car mode which is totally false. HA can not rely on AI and machine learning only human intervention is necessory i discovered when i gone to my audi and he checked and asked me when you drived in car and how much i said i do not have car and no journey taken place but just weared headphones(not earphones) to hear my educational class and not music

In reply to @MDB

Yes, you’re right on the Google/ReSound agreement: ब्लूटूथ LE के ज़रिए, कान की मशीन के साथ काम करने की सुविधा  |  Android Open Source Project5

Perhaps I got off on the wrong track reading something somewhere else about 5.0 and checking the specs on my Samsung Galaxy Note 8, which supports BT 5.0, and remembering that “I’m all set!” with that.

An interesting thought is did Google and ReSound engineer their own special BT recipe? And since Qualcomm charges a premium for its technology, will people avoid that high-fidelity, high-compression low-latency aptX Adaptive standard Qualcomm has just put out, requiring BT 5.0 (here I go again!) to avoid paying Qualcomm’s price, even if it were better than the open standard Google and ReSound have devised?

aptX Adaptive Bluetooth audio delivers low latency and high quality

As headphone jacks continue to disappear, wireless options for audio are becoming more important than ever. In 2015, Qualcomm acquired the aptX codec for Bluetooth audio connections, and currently offers technology as a pair of extended flavors: aptX...

@jim_lewis said:

An interesting thought is did Google and ReSound engineer their own special BT recipe?

Not from how I read things. Check this link:

Streaming support spec for hearing aids on Android8

According to the World Health Organization1, around 466 million people worldwide have disabling hearing loss. This number is expected to increase to 900 million people by the year 2050. Google is working with GN Hearing and its partner Cochlear to...

At the very bottom is this line: (click the here link)
The protocol specification is available here8.

That is this page, and in the second paragraph this is written:

The design of CoC references the Bluetooth Core Specification Version 53 (). To stay aligned with the core specifications, all multi-byte values on this page should be read as little-endian.

Click that BT Core Spec link:

Core Specification | Bluetooth® Technology Website

This specification defines the technologies required to create interoperable Bluetooth devices. Note: Errata Correction 25800 is mandatory when claiming compliance to Core Specification 6.0…

this is on the official Bluetooth SIG Working Group page.

In reply to @parth_p

@parth_p said:

that means AI is just another name of auto switching?

No, but they use to build the automatic program. To help to categorize and create sound environments. And yes, they are not always correct. But they have gotten better.

In reply to @teejayess

@teejayess said:

jim_lewis:

An interesting thought is did Google and ReSound engineer their own special BT recipe?

Not from how I read things. Check this link:

You’re probably right but when I looked over the System Requirements and the GATT Services required to implement (taking off from 4.2),

ब्लूटूथ LE के ज़रिए, कान की मशीन के साथ काम करने की सुविधा  |  Android Open Source Project2 (see down the page under those headings)

since not any old BLE connection will do but one that has to meet those specs is required, that’s where I got the notion that you have to have the hardware and the settings to match as cooked up by Google and ReSound - and we already know that it requires something special both in Android on the phone and in firmware as neither Google nor ReSound have been able to implement yet if it’s just twiddling the BT 4.2 settings ……

Edited
@jim_lewis said:

I looked over the System Requirements and the ASHA GATT Services required to implement BLE (taking off from BT 4.2),

I just noticed something about GATT Service requirements for the Google/ReSound agreement that is perhaps better placed in the thread here announcing their protocol. I will add a link to a post about GATT here when I’m done. GN Hearing and Google announce Android streaming partnership - #33 by jim_lewis

In reply to @wfnorton

Thanks so much for your reply wfnorton! I need to set aside the time to see that video from start to finish! I only made it 10 min through so far. I would definitely be a candidate for the size 13 batts for sure!

Does anyone have any thoughts on the shape of the earbud part? It looked bean-shaped to me in the video - not like the double-dome I have on my current Phonak receivers.

I’m hoping that I’d have no issues with the domes on these Marvel model aids … as it is, I have to swap in size S/M with the L double domes when my ear canals swell up (which they just DO too frequently).

As an Android user now completing six years with my Naidas, I am thrilled to see this, especially in advance of Open Enrollment so I can max out my health care flexible spending account for next year, and hopefully get my hands on these in January. (Which will also give me a little time to see how the earliest adopters feel about them!)

I’ve only ever had Phonaks, so I’m also glad that this is coming from them.

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