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Philips Hearlink first Impressions

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I finally picked up Philips Hearlink miniRITE T R hearing aids at Costco tonight, replacing a set of Kirkland KS8s. ( for “receiver in the ear,” “T” for and “R” for rechargeable lithium batteries.) I paid $2700.

The technician programmed them at my full prescription at high frequencies and slightly reduced amplification at mid and low frequencies as she felt that would give me the best balance between comfort and the ability to understand speech. My KS8s were also programmed to my prescription so I didn’t need a break-in period.

I’ve only had them a few hours, which included shopping in Costco, going out to eat and watching a baseball game on television. My first impressions compared to the KS8s:

  1. Better noise reduction, especially noticeable when our loud a/c comes on at home. The KS8s overwhelmed me with the sound of air rushing through ductwork at home & at work unless I turned them way down. The Philips recognize the noise and suppress it automatically.

  2. Better location and amplification of sound sources in multiple directions. This was a marked improvement over all previous hearing aids. As I was walking around Costco I was overhearing other shoppers’ conversations off to the side and behind me and actually understanding some of what they were saying to each other for the first time in at least 10 years.

  3. Clearer, more natural sound overall. These are programmed as loud as my KS8s but don’t feel like it. It was just my wife and I at the restaurant and it wasn’t excessively noisy, but I did effortlessly understand everything she and our waiter were saying. I might have done just as well with the KS8s under the circumstances, but wouldn’t have been as comfortable.

  4. Worse feedback reduction, but not excessively so. The KS8s perfectly suppressed feedback even when wearing headphones over them; these will feedback a bit when I put my hand up to them.

That’s it for now. I won’t know if the purchase was worth it until I see how they perform at work, but for now I’m cautiously optimistic that I will be able to pick up an extra word of conversation here and there compared to the KS8s.

-Emsgran

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@emsgran said:

As I was walking around Costco I was overhearing other shoppers’ conversations off to the side and behind me and actually understanding some of what they were saying to each other for the first time in at least 10 years.

This is actually one thing that bothers me about the KS8’s. It seems like they are like a “bionic ear” that reaches out and gathers voices that I really should not and don’t want to hear. This may be a soft sounds setup issue though.

The Philips didn’t give me the impression of “gathering voices” — it just seemed like I was hearing the sounds around me a bit more like I used to before I needed hearing aids.

Believe it or not,

the fact that you get a bit of feedback when you cup your hand over them is good.

Some manufacturers employ a capping scheme in their software that regardless of what one does with the programming, cannot be exceeded. This means that there is less high frequency gain being applied.

A hearing aid that gives you a few milliseconds of feedback means they are allowing the high frequencies, and using phase cancellation only to manage the feedback. This strategy makes for a better sounding, better performing hearing aid.

I’m anxious to hear more (no pun intended) about your experience with your new as your loss looks very similar to mine. Thanks for sharing!
-kate.

emsgram wrote:
I’m cautiously optimistic that I will be able to pick up an extra word of conversation here and there
HOHKate replies: What I wouldn’t give for that extra word! The word I miss is often the subject of the conversation – especially when it’s a person or product. Well worth the extra $$$ over the KS8s if the Philips give you that!

Regarding the “extra word,” I can’t really say for sure yet, but based on the first couple of days I think they probably do give me that. (Or it may just be due to increased confidence.)

I was the guest speaker at a church last night and met several people for the first time. I understood most of their names without having to ask them to repeat themselves. I’ll know more after teaching this Sunday and attending my first business meeting next week.

I will say I’m not as happy as I was at first about the noise reduction. I still turned them down driving down the highway and the a/c is still overwhelming the sound of the TV when they are both on.

There is one thing I didn’t expect: even though these are rechargeable, power an 85-decibel speaker, and have a , they are actually narrower than the KS8s and fit more easily alongside my glasses. In the KS8s favor, the controls on the aids are easier to operate.

It’s now been a week with the Philips aids, I have worn them in all the usual work & social environments.

Positives:

  1. Location of sound sources: I know instantly where sounds are coming from without thought or effort. That alone was worth the money and might save my life someday.

  2. Speech comprehension: I’m picking up words better than with my two previous aid brands, and I’m not having to ask people to repeat things as often or defer to my wife during conversations. These aids are forcing me to relearn to pay attention to what people are saying, because if I do I can usually understand them.

Annoyances:

  1. Noise reduction isn’t smart enough to differentiate between speech and a constant background noise (like a/c systems). My luxury car is extremely quiet on the road according to everyone who rides with me, but not with these hearing aids on! It’s obvious the aids think the wind & tire noise the microphone is picking up is actually speech that should be amplified at full volume, because if I turn the sound system on they actually quiet down. Dumb.

  2. The aids are constantly switching volume levels and programs in response to signal input, which is probably what makes the level of amplification I need for speech comprehension possible without being dangerously loud at times, but there’s nothing natural about it and is something prospective buyers should expect.

Other notes: The lithium rechargeable feature is nice, and probably worth the extra $200 to me to not have to deal with changing batteries for the next 3 or 4 years. The controls on the aids are fine for adjusting volume and turning the aids on and off, less so for changing programs. The iPhone compatibility works flawlessly so far. The aids are comfortable behind my ears even with my glasses.

Overall I highly recommend the Philips aids due to the two positives listed above that for me outweigh all other considerations. (I just turn them down in the car!)

If they have patient selectable multi memories, have the tech add a third or fourth memory for the car. Usually, I go in an pull everything down by 30% or so from 1250 hz down to 200 hz, and that acoustically limits the noise of the wind/road/tires.

In reply to @emsgran

Regarding that aid is switching volume and affecting gain, this was exactly my complain about Bernafon Viron and after discussion with my Audi & Bernadine Canada this is how the aids works. But they mentioned that after a while your mind will adopt (I couldn’t as it was distracting me other than my OPN)

Makes sense. These behave the same (although with the faster “Velox” chip and updated programming). I’m going to live with it happily, but I’m sure some people would be miserable.

These aids seem to decrease other noises more effectively than previous aids I’ve had when they detect speech, which increases the signal to noise ratio of speech and improves clarity and comprehension. When they detect speech background noise instantly gets markedly quieter.

For example, I just had a conversation with my wife about new curtains (yikes!) with our loud A/C blower going in the background. These hearing aids recognized our voices and quieted the sound of the blower so well that at one point I wasn’t even sure it was still on. It was, which I heard very well during a pause in the conversation. She is wearing KS8s and I had to speak over the sound of the blower to her because the noise wasn’t reduced at all.

During even brief pauses in speech the background noise comes back. This behavior isn’t “natural” but it is predictable, so I suspect the brain adjusts to predictable events and eventually doesn’t even notice it. But even if that never happens for me the improved speech comprehension is worth the slight annoyance.

In fact I would say the KS8’s work exactly the opposite. They reduce background noise when there is no voice activity, and then when voices are detected in the direction the microphones are focused in, then amplification is increased so you can hear them. It would seem difficult to filter out a blower type noise while at the same time amplifying voices. Speech ranges from about 200 Hz to 6,000 Hz. I suspect they depend on the fact that when voice activity is louder than the constant level background noise your hearing system tends to tune out the lower level noise. Switching programs to change microphone focus seems to help with this issue by ignoring voices and sounds that are not in the direction of interest.

In reply to @emsgran

@emsgran said:

Makes sense. These behave the same (although with the faster “Velox” chip and updated programming). I’m going to live with it happily, but I’m sure some people would be miserable.

Did somebody at Costco officially confirm with you that the Hearlink is based on the faster Velox chip? Or if this is just based on rumors in this forum?

If it’s really based on the faster Velox chip, then it should behave like the OPN S. But based on what’s been described here, it doesn’t sound like that’s how the OPN S behaves.

Yes, the technician at Costco confirmed they use the same chip as in the OPN S, but in an interview I read Demant said the software is different. They indicated that OPN S and Hearlink share the same new anti-feedback software, but the SoundMap noise control and amplification software in the Hearlink Aids are unique to them and the OPN software is unique to Oticon.

The hardware appears to be identical between Philips Hearlink and Oticon OPN S other than case styling. Even the charging station and other accessories are identical other than the brand name.

In case you’re interested, here’s some of the documentation that convinced me to try the Philips Aids, and it describes exactly what I’ve experienced: Our technology107

In reply to @Sierra

@Sierra said:

It would seem difficult to filter out a blower type noise while at the same time amplifying voices.

Yes it would. It detects speech and then directs amplification in that direction just like the KS8s and other brands do.

@Sierra said:

I suspect they depend on the fact that when voice activity is louder than the constant level background noise your hearing system tends to tune out the lower level noise.

I think you’re correct: It “…uses an embedded noise level estimator to lower the compression ratio in specific moments and frequency channels. This preserves access to speech cues, and thereby optimizes the access to speech information in noisy conditions.” And “…this combination of speed and accuracy in SoundMap Noise Control enables it to attenuate noise at a pace faster than the speed of speech.”

I’m not sure I understand all of that, but I do think that’s what I’m experiencing.

In reply to @emsgran

@emsgran said:

Yes, the technician at Costco confirmed they use the same chip as in the OPN S, but in an interview I read Demant said the software is different. They indicated that OPN S and Hearlink share the same new anti-feedback software, but the SoundMap noise control and amplification software in the Hearlink Aids are unique to them and the OPN software is unique to Oticon.

It is consistent with the official channel from Oticon saying that the new feedback technology in the S is shared in the Hearlink. So it does make sense that the new Velox chip is used in order to make use of this new technology.

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