Oticon vs Widex for critical music listening

@gregvoth & @deberh : you won’t be uploading.pdfs, either. You’ll be plugging numbers … good luck.

Thank you for your explanations. I will ask my audi to “customize” the Music Program as you suggested and after using it for a while, I will provide feedback.
Regarding domes, since I started wearing hearing aids, any size of vented dome would not keep the receivers in the canal - they would slip out - and I got custom made acrylic molds, each with one vent. Because of the shape of my ear canals, my Opn S1 were fitted 2 years ago with acrylic so called “Semi Open Skeleton” molds, each also with a vent. So, using vented domes that would allow for more bass sounds, as KeithL mentioned in his commented, unfortunately is not an option for me to experiment with.

@Volusiano said:

But keep in mind that the receivers are tiny little speakers which can produce mid to high frequencies amplification OK, but they lack the physical size to give you the kind of bass you want to hear just because of this limitation.

I was informed some time ago by the esteemed @Um_bongo that Hearing aid receivers are not in fact speakers, but balanced armatures, like those used in IEMs.
I just discovered that, indeed BA’s were 1st used in Hearing aids even b4 IEMs.
Here’s a great explaination11 from one of the top makers of IEMs, Ultimate Ears.
For your reading pleasure, brought to you by the flash!

@flashb1024: Thanks, flash, for that blinding insight (!!!!). I’m pretty sure that @Volusiano was using the term “speaker” as a simple equivalent of “balanced armature” to make a point.

And the point is that neither transducer - no matter its exact nomenclature - moves enough air to produce the auditory sensation of “rich bass”.

@SpudGunner said:

But - don’t you have to have a tuned array of several of the little buggers to get that great IEM sound? (Why aren’t there HAs with multiple receivers, I wonder? Probably just because of power constraints.)

My 1st pair of IEMs were Shure E2’s, which were a single driver.
They really had a rich sound for a $100.00 earphone.While the high end products feature triple drivers, you can get a good sounding pair w/single driver today for about $80.00 US, eh?
Your More 1 HA’s would sound pretty good streaming with the music program, and EQ set to increase bass, with some good foamies!

@SpudGunner said:

{BTW: your “R” character key needs oiling or something … just sayin’}

Is that a reference to our earlier exchange Vis -à- vis the copyright symbol?

@SpudGunner said:

{BTW: your “R” character key needs oiling or something … just sayin’}

Is that a reference to our earlier exchange Vis -à- vis the copyright symbol?
[/quote]

Nope …!

@deberh said:

So, using vented domes that would allow for more bass sounds, as KeithL mentioned in his commented, unfortunately is not an option for me to experiment with.

Just to clarify this point so you don’t misunderstand, what KeithL was saying was that the fully vented open dome allows people with good/better low frequencies hearing (like those with a ski slope loss that doesn’t drop sharply until around 1 or 2 KHz) to still hear the natural unaided low frequencies sounds that can freely travel through the open dome’s vents without any obstruction.

Since your hearing loss doesn’t fit into this category above because you do have significant enough low frequency loss, the open vented dome wouldn’t do you any good to try out anyway because you DO need the amplification in the lows.

Now that you said you have open skeleton acrylic molds with a vent in each, one easy thing to try is to plug up the vent to see if you get more bass improvement or not. It may come at the expense of more occlusion, but if the vent is big, there may be plug options to not close the vent completely but just narrow it down to smaller openings as a compromise. That way you’re not fully occluded but still can plug up some of the leak in the lows.

@Um_bongo: Thank you very much for taking the time to explain this.

As time passes with my new Mores being in my ears 17-18 hours a day, I am coming to an ever greater appreciation of the role the brain and memory of sounds plays in the plastic reconfiguration of how we perceive incoming auditory signals.

I deprived my auditory cortex of input for 6 years, and my target shooting scores attest to the fact that my vision took over a large part of the unused turf. (I’m curious to see whether or not my visual acuity with open sights will diminish as my sense of hearing reclaims more of the neuronal function it surrendered to vision due to sensory deprivation.) Suffice it to say that my BrainHearing is improving the longer I wear my hearing devices.

I’ve listened to several of Dr Donald Shum’s lectures on AudiologyOnline, and I think he and Oticon are generally right: if the hearing instruments can send good quality signals up the auditory nerve, the brain has exquisite capacities for decoding even the imperfect neural code transmitted by a damaged ear.

I’m experiencing first hand the significant improvement in my hearing as my auditory cortex retakes its ground and (as @Blacky has suggested) brain learning reintegrates the memory of sounds past with the real input of sounds present, as rebalanced and amplified by my Oticon More1s.

So, I understand your explanation - perhaps not with perfect scientific accuracy - but I catch the drift. Quality is paramount, one BA receiver can deliver it, more than one can complicate it, and bass sounds are still the bugaboo.

[PS: I learned as a performing musician that bass is as much perceived through sympathetic vibrations within the body as it is heard through the ears, but that’s a musing for another occasion.]

Thanks for replying to my post!

@SpudGunner said:

ope …!

RRRREALLY RESOUNDING REPLY, RIGHT?
Respectfully richly, remotely, resoundingly youRs…
Da Flasherrrr

@SpudGunner said:

I learned as a performing music

Grammer, son, ya gotta getcher grammer write!

It can be added in the Genie 2 programming software. If you’re not a DIY then your audi can set it for you. See first screenshot below.

Streaming doesn’t need any special program because the programs are more for the mic pick up of the environmental sounds. Streaming is broadcasted as how the content is without any doctoring; well, except that it’ll take on some of the settings you have of the default program, like the Speech Rescue settings if you have it enabled, and any equalization you have set for streaming via the ON app. But you can sure try to stream music while toggling between the P1 General (default) program and the Music program (once you’ve added it in) to see if maybe the streaming content may sound different depending on which program you’re in or not.

Actually, there are additional settings that can be set for streaming in Genie 2, like how Fuller or Brighter you want the sound to be, and whether you want varying degrees of the Power Bass or not. And these settings are specific and can be different for the iphone, TV Adapter/EducMic, and ConnectClip. See second screenshot below.

@Volusiano said:

But you can sure try to stream music while toggling between the P1 General (default) program and the Music program (once you’ve added it in) to see if maybe the streaming content may sound different depending on which program you’re in or not.

I definitely hear the soundstage open (pun?) when I enable the Music program.

Ah, thanks for the clarification. So it does pick up the gain controls profile of the program as well then. That’s good to know.

Thank you very much. I have learned quite a bit reading your posts.
I am a would be diy’er. Have a Noahlink wireless that I used to program one set of. ha’s. Tried again the other day and now I cannot get the Noah, or rather the Genie program to connect with the Noah.
Normally a mac person, but bought an inexpensive Asus laptop just to use for adjusting aids. I do not understand the microsoft stuff at all. It gives me more problems than the Genie software which were immense.The Noah powers on but won’t connect.
Looking for someone to help with the computer glitch.
I live in Central America and a day away from the oticon dealer. The service is horrible. But the hearing aids are very good. But may have to change brands as they are so poor at responding to any problems . They can reprogram ha’s using remotecare, but they say they can’t as covid has presented problems for them. They are the only Oticon dealer in the country. Been waiting for over a year to get one backup set adjusted.
You and Hearing tracker have really become a prime source for information not available anywhere else. Again thank you.