I am new to this forum and have a question about online hearing care vs. in office care.
I am 83 years old and have a hearing loss of 49% in my right ear and 58% in my left. In my first visit with the audiologist he suggested a Phonak Paradise 50 PR T and quoted a price of CHF 6,800 (USD 7,385) for two . Yes, Switzerland is very expensive.
I then looked at a few hearing aid companies who provide online sales and service. The same hearing aid model from one of these companies is CHF 1980 for two HA. I already know one of the differences between the two options: In office they offer a trial period of 2 - 3 months with no obligation or cost and the online company only offers a 30 day money back guarantee.
I would like to know the other advantages and disadvantages of the online service, besides the cost of course. The audiologist’s office is only 5 minutes from my home so that is not an issue.
The price you were quoted is extremely high, and for a hearing aid that is not Phonak’s premium technology( the 50 is low tier). Check with other audiologists in your area. Having in person visits to a nearby audiologist for checkups, repairs, and adjustments is an advantage of going with a local audiologist. The price quoted by a audiologists usually includes checkups, adjustments for life of the hearing aid(bundled services). Online companies will have to adjust your hearing aid remotely, which remote adjustments is becoming more common now. So check around for pricing and keep in mind the type of service you will get which is important in getting the best out of the hearing aid. If this audiologist follows up with you, be straight with this person, price you quoted is too high from what you see elsewhere.
Many thanks for the reply. Unfortunately, that price seems to be the standard price for any in office audiologist in Switzerland and negotiating a price reduction is rarely done here. The only option is the online companies.
The online company from which I received a quote includes online support for the life of the hearing aids at no extra cost. It makes sense to me at least that online tuning of the with a video connection is about the same as sitting in an audiologist’s office. The only downside I see is if the devices need a firmware update. I guess sending them back to the company is the only option. I was just wondering if I have overlooked any additional disadvantages to the online option.
I was just wondering if I have overlooked any additional disadvantages to the online option.
Since the online company cannot put a microphone next to your eardrum and measure the output of the hearing aid in your ear with the selected acoustic coupling, they can’t really know if the hearing aid is doing what it is supposed to be doing.
With that kind of price difference I’d go with online and see how it goes. With the 30 day money back I’d give it a go. If you don’t get satisfaction, get your money back and continue to look at options. Just my opinion.
Usually the first thing that happens when I visit my audiologist’s office is they check for wax in my ears, and clean it out if necessary. For me at least, wax has been more of a problem since I started wearing hearing aids. You’d have to get your ears checked and possibly cleaned by a medical provider, or do it yourself, if you use an online hearing aid seller.
Wow. That is phenomenally expensive, and the price difference is significant. The top tier hearing aid for you would be the Phonak Paradise 90 and its variations.
Now, I’d suggest going online, but… giving your age and being a first time hearing aid user, it’s a though situation.
As a first time hearing aid user you will experience a lot of problems and weird things. I doubt online care would be an adequate substitute to face to face interaction. Actually, face to face visits to the audiologist office is what makes the that phenomenally expensive.
As I see, you have the following options:
Buy you HA online: Who knows, maybe you find that this solution works out for you! You can try it for 30 days. For things that require in-person interaction (Real Ear Measurements, , Word Recognition Tests…) you can maybe get a quotation to a private audiologist and pay him for each specific session.
Go : That is, you’re your own audiologist. It’s way easier to fit a hearing aid when you’re the one that wears it. However, that requires considerable patience, time and desire to learn a new skill. I would advice against that for someone your age and experience level.
Just pay whatever they ask you: Well, care comes at a cost. I don’t know your personal background, lifestyle or your economics possibilities but, although the price you got is on the high side of the spectrum for a non premium hearing aid, I’d ask a quotation for the Phonak Paradise P90 and go for it.
You know, people pay a lot for things like flatscreen TVs, computers or phones and they are way less important than your hearing. Getting a hearing aid for the first time is indeed stressful and having someone guiding you in person provides a great relief.
Welcome to this forum! People here are fantastic and we would answer your questions and guide you with a smile on our face. Whatever option you choose, you can ask for advice here!
Also, hearing loss percentages mean nothing. You have the option to post your audiogram on your profile and that would be helpful when answering you.
Make sure that the local audiologist will do a real ear measurement as part of the initial fitting and that they will do follow-up fittings. You are paying an inflated price for the bundled service they are going to be providing so find out for how long they will be providing this service without charging you any additional fee. You need to ask lots of questions to make sure that your money is being used wisely. Also, what other hearing aids do they offer other than the Phonak and what are the prices? There are a lot of good hearing aids on the market at this time, so don’t lock yourself into just the one brand or type.
And know that hearing aid fitting is a process that can take a while; it is not like buying glasses. Your brain has to get used to using them and needs to work along with the hearing aids to make your use successful.
I would also second the suggestion that you check around for other audiologists in your area just to see what they may offer that would work for your particular need. Good luck!
I had good results with an online purchase in the U.S, programming and follow up service via an audiologist who worked with the online company to supplement their business. I’m curious if you traveled to France, Italy, Germany or Austria whether the price at an audiologists would get any better. Swiss prices for almost everything are inflated, especially airport hamburgers!
Neville and others will enumerate the cons when doing this and they are real.
Fortunately in the USA the company provides online adjustments which is available on the Paradise hearing aid and others.
I sent the company my , test results and ear molds.
When my arrived, they had been adjusted as well as possible with the data I had provided the company.
They worked pretty good on arrival.
But, I made an appointment with them and had a couple of small adjustments made Online.
I did this out of respect for fitter (I did not mention to them that I use Target and my own fittings for obvious reasons), since I am a and could have done it myself. However, I would recommend this approach to anyone, DIY or otherwise.
Fitting is free with them for one year.
Since then, I have made a few other adjustments.
Bottom line, I quite like my Paradise and the joy goes way up because of the cost savings.
I also am 83 years old. Here are a few thoughts. Programming hearing aids is tough (I do it but have some specialized equipment -a Hi Pro and a copy of Phonaks Software). But if you DO go to the audiologist BE SURE they do a Real Ear" measurement as part of the test. Many don’t but it is critical. I have also contacted audiology departments at training Universities and they have sometimes been extremely helpful and knowledgeable. I have bought Phonak Marvel 90’s on ebay for $1200 and asked around (beforehand) if any local audiologists would program them for a fee (don’t expect the to be too low as they are not to happy to do this…but they do). There are places in the US (Costco’s sell the nearly identical Phonak product for around $1800 a pair) so if you visit the US you could take this route. The downside of that is they are linked to the Costco store so you could have difficulty if something happens later. Your local audiologist isn’t doing you any favors offering you the “50” product. Good Luck
BE SURE they do a Real Ear" measurement as part of the test. Many don’t but it is critical.
This is not correct, is not a “critical” part of useful programming of your , as a yourself, you’ll know that you can in fact set your HAs to sound just how you like them without it, it’s just another tool in toolbox for the clinics, but not the holy grail of fitting.
The downside of that is they are linked to the Costco store so you could have difficulty if something happens later.
This won’t be an issue as such, the warranty is Phonak through Costco, any audiology clinic could send to Phonak for a warranty repair and expect them to honour it.
For the most part i agree with your comments. Just tonight I re programmed my v90’s from Target 5.3 with Nal-2 and a Hi Pro without real ear and they are fine. I just doubt the 83 year old in question has the skills…not that they can’t be learned…and without them they are at the mercy of a careless audiologist who doesn’t do real ear. . I’m glad to know the exact price at Costcos but there has always been an issue with them locking their aids to their proprietary software which makes them useless elsewhere. Maybe they’ve changed…but without access to the software aids are useless.
I think at this point only the Philips and maybe one other brand are locked. The KS-10s aren’t locked and can be programmed with a Noah link wireless and target.
at Costcos but there has always been an issue with them locking their aids to their proprietary software which makes them useless elsewhere.
Yes they did do this in another life, but Costco don’t lock their respective models anymore, as you’ll notice we have a very active forum and all the latest from Costco are not locked.
I just doubt the 83 year old in question has the skills…not that they can’t be learned…and without them they are at the mercy of a careless audiologist who doesn’t do real ear.
Yeah I get what your saying here, so I guess the best thing is for the OP to shop around, and try to find a sympathetic audiology clinic, there’s plenty of them around, they out number the “bad apples” 10:1 I’m sure.
First, let me say that I am overwhelmed by your responses to my question and the quality of your suggestions. I think I have found the right forum. I would like to follow up on a few of your points.
(OpenFitted and Ric) - Although I am long in the tooth I have no problem with technical DIY and love to learn new skills. Even though it was not my main profession I have programmed for years, developed websites and helped friends with computer problems. I appreciate your other suggestions.
Wax problems (x475aws) - The only audiologist I have seen so far does not clean ear wax buildup. I had my ears cleaned by an doctor who subsequently did the hearing test before meeting with the audiologist.
Real ear measurement (jdc1117 & Ric) - I’m not sure what this means. Are you referring to the configuration of the ear canal to select and fit the dome of the receiver or a different issue. (tenkan) seems to disagree that it is “critical”. I asked the online company how they know which dome fits my ear and their response was that they have software to do some type of 3D scan.
Measuring HD output (Neville) - I assume you are saying that the only way to measure the HD output is with a microphone. Is this only necessary when there is a problem or is it part of tuning every HD?
Other brands (jdc1117) - The audiologist I saw offers any of the major brands of HD. I think he suggested Phonak because he is a good Swiss and Phonak is a Swiss company (part of Sonova AG) :-).
P50 vs P90 - OpenFitted and several of you have suggested that with my hearing loss the P50 may be inadequate for my hearing loss. I would appreciate additional comment on this issue and have attached the results of my hearing test ( - right ear red, left blue). The P90 from the audiologist would cost in the neighbourhood of USD 9,500 - 10,000.
My apologies if I overlooked some of your suggestions; there were more responses than I had anticipated.
Yes, I agree. Switzerland is expensive!
I’ve been offered a pair of P90Rs for 8900.- CH in January. Then bought them online for 3’300€ in the Netherlands. Doing now with great success and with the help of this forum’s members! It is now some kind of new hobby for me.
I assume you would not buy them online in Switzerland?
There might be a drawback then: it can get complicated if you have to send them back for repairs. May take long delays for shipping and also needs complicated custom procedures.
I found a local audiologist wich is ready to send mine to Phonak Switzerand for me. Just need to pay him a small fee of 50.-. I already needed this service for a guarantee-replacement of one . And I had them back within 3 days!
Maybe also go to other Audiologists to get quotations. There are big differences price-wise. Some of the big chains are much more expensive than a self-owned office.
Don’t be blinded by a long guarantee. That’s not an issue. Phonak charges 200.- for a repair even if they replace the aid for a new one.
I agree with @tenkan. is not really needed if you DIY. (It is a very expensive equipment only audiologists can afford). And by the way, I’m now with my third set of HA since 2006. No one ever did REM. I learnt here in the forum about it.
I assume you would not buy them online in Switzerland?
I should have mentioned in my profile that I live in Switzerland and the online company is here as well so the expense of mailing is not that great.
As you are most likely aware we don’t have big chains here so that is not even an option if I even wanted to consider it. I do plan to get other quotes from other audiologists however the offer from the online company is a great one. Their list price for a pair of P 90PR T is CHF 2’780 ((€2’688) and with our OASI (old-age and survivors insurance) payment the price per pair drops to CHF 1’543 (€1’490).
That’s really a good price and good to know they are located in Switzerland as well.
They probably offer also remote programming. So you do not yet need to decide whether to go or not.
I’m a bit younger, so mine was partly paid by IV.
In office they offer a trial period of 2 - 3 months with no obligation or cost
Why not use this opportunity to test the aids?
I did this before I decided to buy online. Even copied the programming at home to have a backup-setting for DIY. I never needed it afterward
For DIY you would need a Noahlink Wireless. Just google it.
For help to get the SW go to the DIY-Section in this forum.
I’ll consider doing this but if all goes well I would feel a bit guilty about cancelling the trial after all the tuning and assistance from the audiologist.
Switzerland
Spain
