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Oticon More TV Adapter connectivity experiments

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I have been experimenting to try to figure out the connectivity issue with the TV adapter, the hearing aids and the iPhone, iPad and the ON app. What I have discovered is that the issue seems to be with the IPhone. I will try to explain, I have the IPhone 13 and before that the IPhone SE2020, and I have the iPad mini 5 without cellular radios.
I have found that if I have the iPhone and the ON app I have the connectivity issues, it doesn’t matter if I have the WiFi off and also the cellular radios off. I have seen this with the iPhone 13 and SE2020,and the iPhone 7.
With the iPad mini 5 with the ON app I can connect to the TV Adapter even with low battery percentage left on my More1 rechargeable aids, I don’t have the connectivity issues with the iPad or the ON app.
I have also found if I first reboot the iPhone then I can connect to the TV adapter using the iPhone control panel and connectivity is okay but if I try it a second time with out the reboot I have the connectivity issues. If I use the aids to make the connection or the connect clip and I am guess the remote control the issue with the iPhone is still the same. I am not sure what the cause is, it may be the cellular radios even when disabled, my iPad is WiFi only.
I was told this afternoon by my Audiologist that Oticon will be releasing a firmware update about the first of May that will address connectivity issues and possible the full hands free for the More1 aids at least for MFI. I was told that the VA will receive the updates on the first of May with the releases of the new contract.

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Interesting about the firmware update… hope Oticon pushes one out for OPN S … Apologies for being “dense” , but what do you mean by “TV adapter connectivity” issues? Do you mean you aren’t able to connect to TV adapter using the app ? I still have the aid restarting issue when connected to TV adapter, but if I turn off Bluetooth on the phone, that seems to solve the issue… of course, I’d rather not have to turn off bluetooth but it’s better than having aids restarting every couple of minutes… with bluetooth on, when one of the aids restarts , the ON app will struggle to connect again - so that’s why I just turn bluetooth when connected to the TV adapter…

Edited

I don’t really understand what you’re saying at all, Chuck. First of all, why would you want to use the TV Adapter for the iPhone and iPad? I believe that you have the ConnectClip and that should be the appropriate device to connect to your iPhone or iPad via Bluetooth, that is, and only if you don’t want to use the iOS MFI connection at all for some reason, like for hands-free phone calls perhaps. Otherwise, MFI should be the best and most direct way to connect between your Oticon More and the iPhone or iPad.

The TV Adapter is not Bluetooth compatible so if you try to connect it to the iPhone or iPad, you’d have to be drive the headphones output of the iPhone or iPad into the audio AUX IN (the RCA left and right input) of the TV Adapter. This would be a very backward way to use the TV Adapter in the first place. The TV Adapter is really only meant for device with analog audio or optical audio connection and don’t support Bluetooth.

Heck, starting with the iPhone 7 (or is it 6?), you no longer even have a headphones plug directly on the iPhone anymore and you’d have to use an adapting connector to plug in your wired headphones into it.

What am I missing here? Or did you mean to say ConnectClip instead of TV Adapter? And even then, like I said, MFI is the way to go to connect to iPhone and iPad, not the ConnectClip, unless for hands-free phone calls.

I know I am not great explaining things. Think of it this way. What was the TV adapter designed for? It streams the TV to my hearing aids. Now think of the ways to control the volume the streaming from the TV adapter within the aids. The IOS control panel can control both the TV streaming volume but the hearing aid microphone volume. Also the ON can do both too, but the aids can only control their microphone volume. I have both the iPhone and iPad. The iPad doesn’t lose connectivity to the aids as the iPhone does when I issue the command to connect to the TV adapter to my aids, that goes for both the ON app and the IOS control panel.

fingers crossed whatever firmware update they do will work for OPNS as well… I don’t have a problem connecting to TV adapter - I do have problem with volume defaulting to loudest setting if aids get disconnected from TV adapter and then reconnect … and ON app is always trying to reconnect as well… is that the issue you have?

I never lose connectivity with the TV adapter it is always with the iPhone and ON on the iPhone. If I disabled the Bluetooth on my iPhone and only use my iPad I don’t have the issues. And since the latest firmware update on my aids, my TV adapter volume settings are remembered. I am sorry but I really don’t believe that Oticon is going to do any more firmware updates to the older OPN or OPNS aids.

Sadly, you’re probably right and OPNS and firmware updates… I can always hope… so your issue is with ON app connecting to iphone? I got confused when you mentioned TV adapter… my TV volume never stays where I need/want it… audiologist checked and it’s at 2 (out of 5) in the software… but it always defaults to 16 in the app and WAY too loud… someone mentioned that TV adapter volume is “tied” to Program 1 and suggested I have audiologist lower volume in Program 1 … I’m waiting to hear back from audiologist - she wanted to check with Oticon to see if that would work…

I believe that is an issue in the OPNS firmware, my OPNS1 have that is too. My issue is that anytime I connect to the TV adapter my aids lose connectivity with the ON app on the iPhone and that seems to cause the iPhone to also lose connectivity. But if I disable the Bluetooth on the iPhone and enable Bluetooth on the iPad then I don’t have any issues with connectivity

Edited

In reply to @cvkemp

@cvkemp said:

I know I am not great explaining things. Think of it this way. What was the TV adapter designed for? It streams the TV to my hearing aids. Now think of the ways to control the volume the streaming from the TV adapter within the aids. The IOS control panel can control both the TV streaming volume but the hearing aid microphone volume. Also the ON can do both too, but the aids can only control their microphone volume. I have both the iPhone and iPad. The iPad doesn’t lose connectivity to the aids as the iPhone does when I issue the command to connect to the TV adapter to my aids, that goes for both the ON app and the IOS control panel.

Sorry, I still don’t understand what you’re trying to say. But that’s OK, whatever works for you. I just don’t see the need for whatever it is you’re trying to do.

I still would just use the MFI connection between my iPhone and iPad to the Oticon directly and never mess with the TV Adapter as an intermediary device between them because it serves no purpose to me. I can control the streaming volume from the iPhone and iPad just fine via the physical volume buttons on the iPhone and iPad, and still independently control the HA’s mic volume level (not the streaming content volume level) in 3 different ways:

  1. Via the hard volume buttons on my Oticon HAs.
  2. Or via the iOS MFI HAs’ mic volume control sliders.
  3. Or via the ON app HA’s mic control volume sliders.

That’s how I use my Oticon HAs between my iPhone and iPad, via the direct MFI connection to control either the streaming content volume or the HAs’ mic volume independently. Oticon has designed things to work very seamlessly between their HAs and the iOS interface already to begin with without needing the user to tinker with using anything else, much less an expensive TV Adapter.

Then there is also a built-in Genie 2 setting as seen in the screenshot below to control the relative volume levels between the streaming content’s volume and the HA’s mic volume to begin with.

So I still don’t really see any problem between streaming content volume control and HAs’ mic volume control that needs to be solved by using the TV Adapter to be able to control those 2 volume levels independently in parallel, when you’re just connecting your Oticon HAs to either the iPhone or iPad.

Maybe if you can state the issue you see and are trying to solve clearly up front first, instead of just jumping in with both feet and start talking about using the TV Adapter as an intermediary solution device to your “issue”. That would be a better start to begin with, via a clearly articulated statement of the “issue” you’re seeing.

image

It doesn’t matter any time I connect to the TV adapter with my aids the aids drops the connectivity to the iPhone and the iPhone installed ON when that happens you can’t control the volume of the streaming from the TV adapter. But it doesn’t happen with my iPad. I agree the iPhone doesn’t connect to the Tv adapter but to the aids. The issue is the connectivity back to the iPhone from the aids. You are over thinking the issue

Edited

OK, if you had said that as your issue statement in the first place, then it would not have confused people like me and made me overthink anything too much.

Nevertheless, it’s still not a clear issue statement to me, so let me reiterate to make sure I understand your issue exactly. Are you saying that if you’re using (connecting to) your TV Adapter to watch whatever on your TV (or whatever source device driving your TV Adapter), then the aids drop the connectivity to your iPhone?

If that is what you said, then I actually found the exact opposite to what you stated above. When I’m both connected to the TV Adapter (after I’ve switched to aids to the TV Adapter program) and the iPhone, and I’m listening to the streaming content from my TV Adapter, then if I start playing something on my iPhone in parallel to it, the streaming content on my iPhone would OVERRIDE what I hear from the TV Adapter (while the TV Adapter is still sending streaming content from its source to my aids). If/when I stop playing the streaming content from my iPhone, then a few seconds later, the streaming content from the TV Adapter resumes. So this tells me that the streaming content from the iPhone takes priority over the streaming content from the TV Adapter, not the other way around like you described.

As far as controlling the volume of the streaming content, I can control the volume content of my iPhone’s stream via the iPhone’s hard volume button just fine if I’m playing the iPhone’s streaming content. During this time, my iOS MFI and the ON app is still showing that I’m currently selecting the TV Adapter program (as I did), and there are 2 volume sliders there, one for the aids’ mics (called Environment in the ON app, or Mic Level in the MFI menu), which primarily affects the aids’ mic, but ALSO affects the TV Adapter streaming volume as well. The other volume slider, called Streaming in the ON app or TV Adapter/EducMic in the MFI menu) strictly controls the volume of the TV Adapter streaming content only and does not affect the aids’ mic level.

Of course what I’m describing here is for my Oticon OPN 1, not for the Oticon More. However, I would be very surprised if Oticon uses different streaming content priority flows between their OPN and OPN S and More.

In reply to @Volusiano

I have OPN S … whenever I’m using TV adapter box, the ON app will not connect to iphone … I see it trying to connect - sometimes it will connect (after several minutes) … some times it will never reconnect until I disconnect from TV adapter (and I have to use aid buttons to switch programs…) I also have the issue of aid restarting every couple minutes when I’m using TV adapter… I have to turn Bluetooth OFF on iphone (12 pro) and that fixes the issue, but then I don’t have bluetooth and if someone calls me , I have to turn blutooth back on,etc… it’s very annoying and frustrating…

I’m sorry to hear about your issues between your OPN S and the ON app. I have the OPN 1, and while I hardly use the ON app, in the experiment I just did before my last post to Ken to verify that everything I said is correct, I was connected to the TV Adapter first, verified that it was working fine, then open up the ON app on my iPhone and was able to get the ON app to connect to my OPN, then verified that the volume sliders on the ON app works while I was using my TV Adapter. I really can’t say why I didn’t have that problem but you do. All I can think of is maybe there’s a versioning issue somewhere. I would try using the iOS MFI interface instead of the ON app, just to eliminate a variable (aka the ON app). Your OPN S should be automatically connected to your iPhone 12 Pro MFI already as a given once you have them paired up. So if the iOS MFI interface works for you in terms of controlling its volume sliders, but the ON app has trouble connecting to the OPN S, then we know it’s the issue with the ON app and not the iOS MFI. Then you can verify that you have the latest version of the ON app, and maybe also the latest version of the iOS, if not already.

In terms of the issue of the TV Adapter connection restarting your OPN S every few minutes unless you turn off the on your iPhone, the first thing I would check is whether you have the latest firmware version in your TV Adapter or not. I don’t recall having to update my TV Adapter’s firmware for years, so I’m not sure if that’s the root cause for you or not, but I guess it doesn’t hurt to check.

It’s possible that your TV Adapter is causing all these issues all by itself, but then the fact that it operates independently by itself means that it’s unlikely finicky although I guess it can be. Is there another TV Adapter you can borrow from your to try out just to compare? If you have the same issues with the borrowed TV Adapter, then you know that it’s probably a versioning incompatibility issue somewhere → the iOS version, → the ON app version, → the firmware version of your OPN S, the firmware version of your TV Adapter.

All I can say is that I don’t experience any of these problems, and I “think” I’m on the latest firmware version and iOS, ON app version, so that’s just a data point to show that the flow Oticon design works OK as intended for me. But of course things do get pretty complex, so the only way to figure things out is to methodically sort through and review all the versions to make sure you’re on the latest, then go through the process of elimination like using the iOS MFI instead of the ON app, or swapping out your TV Adapter for a different (borrowed) one to see if thing behave differently to help lead you to come toward some kind of conclusion.

Thanks… I"ve tried a different adapter… same issue… Oticon even sent me new aids… same issue… I have all the latest firmware for everything … as far as I know… I’m pretty sure it’s an issue of TV adapter and the phone “fighting” for the bluetooth signal … I think that’s what Apple said… Oticon wasn’t any help as far as possible solution… I think it makes sense, since turning OFF bluetooth solves the issue … Maybe I’ll just unpair from the app and use the iOS MFI interface …

Edited

Hm, that’s definitely a headscratcher for sure then, if both Oticon and Apple were involved and still couldn’t figure it out. Yeah, I think you’re right that there’s some kind of incompatibility or contention issue in the Bluetooth space, but the question is why you have that issue but others like me don’t. There’s probably some other environmental factor in your surrounding (perhaps some kind of interference) that exists where your live but not where I live. That’s the only obvious other thing I can think of that interferes with how the works and wrecks all the handshaking between the devices unless something gives (in this case by turning off the BT). Because otherwise, if it’s a true bug of some sort, it’s probably widespread enough to prompt enough outcry from the customer base to force the mfgs into some kind of more concerted debugging action.

Actually, if I unpair from the app and stay connected to iphone, the issue is still there, so just using the iOS MFI interface won’t solve it… guess I’ll just stick with turning off for now … It will be VERY disappointing if Oticon does NOT push out any more firmware updates because OPN isn’t the “latest and greates” anymore…

I’m not defending Oticon or anything, but I think if they can truly determine that it’s a reproducible bug that may affect all their model lines (the OPN, the OPN S and the More) and they can fix the bug, then I just don’t see why they would make the code change and roll out to the More line only and not the OPN and OPN S line simply because they’re not the latest and greatest anymore.

To me, the effort is in the debugging, the reproduction of the bug, and the code change to fix the bug. Any code change they need to make to the More, it’s probably just the same code change for the OPN and OPN S (in terms of the TV Adapter wireless streaming) because most likely they use the same algorithm that they had from the OPN to the OPN S then the More for the TV Adapter wireless streaming. So rolling out a new firmware for an older model line is almost next to trivial to make available, and it can only help with customer retention who will be happy to move to the More instead of seeking other brands when they’re ready for an upgrade. The main challenge is finding the root cause of the problem and fix it, not rolling out a firmware update. Now if not too many users run into this problem, the bigger challenge is to determine how much resources they should put in to debug a problem that not enough people reported.

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