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Phonak Naida Review/Rant/Fustrations LoL

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There’s not much to know on it other than it’s a bluetooth transmission medium to connect from Phonak iPFG fitting software to Naida/exelia digital aids. I thought I heard that the iCom/MyPilot combo would do the same, but I think I was mistaken…

My 5-year-old daughter has been just fitted with this new aid, I listended to it one night, I was so suprised that it has a constant loud white noise when the house was very quiet. It’s like the noise of a water fall when you stand right beside it. I then listened to her old Siemens, it doesn’t have any noise. Our audi listened this model in the consignment with her settings(he didn’t listen to the aid) and he said it’s not noisy. Is this normal? At the moment a hearing aid is programmed, does it matter the environment is quiet or not?

Thanks.

Barring background noise, and assuming the aids were not switched to , which can pick up interference although the interference will get less when you move away from the source, if all is quiet then those aids should be quiet. No white noise. Take them back and have the audiologist listen to the aids using a stethescope. Tell him you would like to listen to them to. If you are not satisfied let him know.

Well, my audio listened to the aid and said the noise is normal because of the high gain. Even when we feel the house is quiet there is soft sounds which are amplified by the aid.

Tell them to adjust the threshold Kneepoint. What is most likely happening is since there is such high gain the aid is probably over amplifying the very soft sounds. She is probably gettign too much ambiant room noise–I find this to ba a “problem” (although very easily solved)pretty often with the Naida in the software there is a place where your audiologist can “increase the TK” if she does this a few times you should notice that white noise decreases. If it does not change then this is not the problem–However you should NOT be able to hear white noise of static coming from the hearign aid–this is NOT normal

audiosmalls, thanks. The white noise is just like water running noise. The audiologist thinks my daughter probably won’t hear the white noise because she is very deaf(her follows), but the noise is unbearable to me because I am a normal hearing person. Do you mean I should not hear the loud white noise while listening to the aid through a stethescope? I’ll have him adjust the TK asap because I am thinking now that if the soft noise is amplified so much then they are competing with the speech sounds, yes?

Also do you have experience with the frequency transpose? Do you know how long does it take a child to grasp? When I do Ling test with her, she consistently says ‘h’ to ‘s’, it’s been more then a week now. My understanding is the ‘s’ is transposed to a lower pitch, will she eventually get it right or the program needs to be tuned right a way? My audio is more specialized on , he doesn’t program a lot, my daughter is his patient becuase she also has a CI.

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In reply to @HearingLossClinic

@HearingLossClinic said:

As an audiologist in Calgary I have to say that the Naida has been a great success in our clinic. I have fit approximately 30 of them this year and I have only had 1 person reject them. The Naida is quite complex to fit and there are many adjustments that can be made. I have found that many people enjoy the soundrecover feature however it is best to have it gradually introduced rather then introduced all at once. The noise management features can also be reduced or turned off so those of you who like hearing all the sounds around you can still experience that. It is important that you see an audiologist who is knowledgeable and has experience in fitting this particular product. Let me know if I can help you with your hearing aid and make the experience more successful.

ok im in the trial period with naida vsp my audioligest picked them for me.in the car they are hard to hear with they seem to change quality sound on their own .The other day I was in Canadian Tire talking to the paint man or trying to, I just couldn’t get what they were saying. Sometimes they are good and other times very bad. Should Naida vsp be like this or is it my profound hearing loss? I asked to try phonac cause I read they were the best or up there ,anyway what are your thoughts on my frustrations I used to have beltone aids.
One more question is it possible to understand all tv speach with hearing aids or not I sit and watch pictures a good deal of the time not understanding what they are saying thank you Richard

hi i think your in the same boat as me .Same frustrations with naida as I have, my own voice is gruff and the echoing. I do think they are good aids but we need to find a very talanted audi.
If you read what the audiolagest said from Calgary she’s had great success with her patients . I have a question, are you able to understand much on the tv? I miss lots watching tv Im trying phonak naida vsp they were ordered by my audi .I think hearing aid success depends souly on how good the audiologist is.I understand phonak has a lot of adjustments .take care

Hi Everyone. I have 2 Naida 9’s and 1 Naida 3 as a backup. I have moderate to severe hearing loss with most all my highs gone.

Recently this week I asked my dispenser to turn off data logging on the hearing aids. I would like to say there has been a massive improvement in speech intelligibility as well as overall comfort all day by just using the basic overall melody channel. I really recommend everyone to try this programming once and see if you feel better, that is if you are having lengthy fitting problems like I did. I suspect that data logging is attemting to dampen (too much) the overall performance of all the other features.

Since i have owned these aids for a bit over a year, they have been totally replaced once (first batch were lemons) and repaired twice (factory replaced electronics). I question its overall durability and do not recommend anyone purchasing them without a coverage plan and additional insurance beyond coverage limit. When they work they are fantastic and I love them…when they work. I have to say, nothing in the market beats the reliability and durability of SIEMENS.

My next pair will be from them definitely, that is if they meet the same sound quality that I am getting from the Naidas. I am confident they have one now.

Hi Matthew. No I do not self tune yet (dispenser in training), but I do spend a lot of time bothering my dispenser and she likes a challenge so its all good. I just simply pay attention to her software behavior and read the options in there and then ask questions about the features.

Did you know there’s a lot of subcategories in basic settings? For example say you select speech and noise or maybe say music-you will find more selections in a drop down menu applied to that speech and noise or music to specific enviroments that might meet your needs. There’s so many there it’s too much to list here. Ask your dispenser to show you this.

I spend a good deal of time explanation specific details I notice in my daily life in visual detail that would be easy for a hearing person to sort of experience from my end I suppose. . You have to be really aware of your hearing and pay attention. It’s tiresome at times I know :slight_smile:

As of late, I have noticed automatic gains and suppressions like in a form of a wave. It is really annoying and I also notice that this event occurs in several days or hours after the new fitting. That is why I sent this repair out. Problem is gone for now. Phonak states replacement of internal electronics. As I said, it’s a durability issue.

This has happened in 3 results from fittings so far (that wave i mentioned of gains and fades…aid will also whistle no matter how you program it). Now that I have my second aid out for repairs, I am wearing the Naida 3 as backup, I am finding the 3 outperforming the 9 (in terms of overall volume gains and clarity).

For last week’s repaired hearing aid experience in a nutshell is that people have said this week that I am not yelling anymore. I myself can easily understand personal conversations, radio and television a lot more (with less actual speaker volume too).

In the course of about 1 1/2 years, I have had approx 20 programming fittings done for all models I own. Take time finding that golden spot. Sometimes that golden spot could trick you and it could mean it is that data logging confusing you, so try turning it off and see what happens. It isn’t easy I know, but it is sure worth it.

I will follow up when I am wearing all repaired Naida 9’s only with no data logging and no Naida 3 in either ear to make a final conclusion. There is something definitely interesting going on here.

In reply to @Hask12

Hey,

I have a severe hearing loss in my right ear and a profound loss in my left ear. I currently use the Widex P38 in both ears-my first pair of digital aids after using analogs.

I took the Naida V on trial today. Is there any feedback from you guys on which model within the Naida series works better for you? Are more channels better or less in terms of finding that “golden spot” when programming the aids? (Especially those who grew up using analog aids, as I did).

Thanks!

Edited

The preference towards more more channels is just a waste your particular case IMHO, the V will work fine. If your are looking at the software, getting the ‘Global Compression’ turned down will make the aid operate in a more linear fashion and usually makes it sound better for transitioning wearers.

The P38 you had before would have had slower attack and especially release times, you might find the sound ‘jumps’ around a little. You can get the settings of the Soundflow turned a bit lower/less sensitive to reduce this effect.

In reply to @skyblue

@skyblue said:

audiosmalls, thanks. The white noise is just like water running noise. The audiologist thinks my daughter probably won’t hear the white noise because she is very deaf(her audiogram follows), but the noise is unbearable to me because I am a normal hearing person. Do you mean I should not hear the loud white noise while listening to the aid through a stethescope? I’ll have him adjust the TK asap because I am thinking now that if the soft noise is amplified so much then they are competing with the speech sounds, yes?

Also do you have experience with the frequency transpose? Do you know how long does it take a child to grasp? When I do Ling test with her, she consistently says ‘h’ to ‘s’, it’s been more then a week now. My understanding is the ‘s’ is transposed to a lower pitch, will she eventually get it right or the program needs to be tuned right a way? My audio is more specialized on CI, he doesn’t program HA a lot, my daughter is his patient becuase she also has a CI.

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It’s difficult to say what you mean by white noise, as though similar, the hearing aid noise of the Naidas with a low TK does sound like white noise, but it isn’t, at least not to my ears.

Your audio is probably right in saying she is unlikely to hear. I assume the audio wants to get as much sound in as possible, including the soft sounds. I doubt they are competing with speech sounds as the hearing aid amplifies the different sound levels different - although with that kind of hearing loss there is unfortunately not a great deal of room to work in.

I’m not sure I’d suggest changing the TK as your daughter has a close to profund hearing impairment and I would assume your audio is quite right in saying she is unlikely to be able to hear it - does she say if she can or not?

In terms of adapting to sound recover, the process is a bit longer than standard hearing aids (a few months) but it isn’t an area that has had a great deal of research and the verdict is still out on whether or not sound recover is beneficial. But its definitely something that needs a period of months for you to be able to see if there is any benefit along with speech testing to give some objective results. And I think in terms of + Sound recover there is even less information on how well the brain is able to synthesise two quite different sets of information.

Has your daughter been able to sit through a full and get the thresholds for 6 and 8 kHz yet? Do you know how strongly the sound recover has been put on?

Soundrecover can be set differently and the default settings provided by the Naida fitting software are often way off / useless. Ask your audio where the sound recover is set to.

Hi Um Bongo,

Thanks for the help…it was useful! I am going back to the audiologist today to get the volume adjusted-the hearing aids were set rather loud.

A general question to everyone:
Which model within the Naida series works better for you guys? Are more channels better or less?
Also, are you guys happy with the automatic programs/do you use them at all?

Hey,

I noticed that earlier in this thread a lot of people complained about speech sounding muffled/“underwatery”. The solutions thrown up in the thread suggesting adjusting compression/bass sound.

What exactly needs to be done to compression to solve the muffled speech problem?

I didn’t have this problem until the audiologist lowered the volume for low frequencies (initially background sound was painfully loud, but speech sounded fine).

@Sanaya said:

Hey,

I noticed that earlier in this thread a lot of people complained about speech sounding muffled/“underwatery”. The solutions thrown up in the thread suggesting adjusting compression/bass sound.

What exactly needs to be done to compression to solve the muffled speech problem?

I didn’t have this problem until the audiologist lowered the volume for low frequencies (initially background sound was painfully loud, but speech sounded fine).

As a general rule the speech inputs will be the medium to high frequencies at the medium intensity level say 60dB. Increasing these will usually help. Doing this ‘blind’ without a corresponding is hazardous as the true effect of the changes made is unknown.

I use a live mechanism to observe this kind of tuning.

In reply to @audiosmalls

@audiosmalls said:

Tell them to adjust the threshold Kneepoint. What is most likely happening is since there is such high gain the aid is probably over amplifying the very soft sounds. She is probably gettign too much ambiant room noise–I find this to ba a “problem” (although very easily solved)pretty often with the Naida in the software there is a place where your audiologist can “increase the TK” if she does this a few times you should notice that white noise decreases. If it does not change then this is not the problem–However you should NOT be able to hear white noise of static coming from the hearign aid–this is NOT normal

How can we guess the appropriate tk level?

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