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Can an audiophile be satisfied with music streaming sound quality from a hearing aid?

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In reply to @tony2

@tony2 said:

Some guidance on the basics would be very much appreciated!

The Search icon at the top right of this window is your path to a multitude of info on and music.
You can spend hours,
Also google search Dr. Marshall Chasin who is an specializing in fitting musicians.

Streaming music to my prior Oticons (keep in mind this was “10” years ago) was just so terrible, so tinny that I did it once or twice to try it & then never again. My update to Phonak Marvels 3 years ago was such a huge leap I was in awe. I stream to this pair pretty much daily & I would never consider updating to anything that can’t do as good or better with clear rich music reproduction.

In reply to @user36

I don’t have any troubles at all with my Marvels. There are a lot of variables though - it could be to do with your Computer, WIN version (assuming WIN), Wifi/ card, etc… Specifics for me is - Dell XPS 15 with WIN 10 & updated Wifi adapter (Intel Wi-Fi 6 AX200). The default Wifi with the Dell was a Killer card a little bit finicky but still mostly ok. I actually have the opposite problem - always connects (& then I need to disconn for probably majority of the time when I’m using speakers) whereas I wish I could choose for it NOT to by default & only when I manually connect it. That is WINDOWS shortsightedness though.

@al11 said:

Please share your thoughts and experiences.

Difficult to answer question. An audiophile by definition is a difficult to satisfy customer…
I recently started using Jabra Pro 10s. When I stream, there is basically no base at all. Below 500-600 Hz it is just dead. I went back twice to Costco asking the streaming to be pumped up but and while the chap I saw on the second visit was a lot more promising, so far no joy.
Technically, the hearing aids don’t have much under 250Hz (500Hz with open dome) and above 8K.
What they have is mostly distorted due to the mega processing done on board. If you have molds, than you may be better but with open domes there is no hope whatsoever. I am not saying they wont give you somewhat better sound compared to without them, just what you get would be nowhere near audiophile.
So in my opinion, the simple answer to the headline question is no.
If you really want to get anywhere near the audiophile experience you had using your , I would say the best option would be to use your regular speakers to give you anything below 500Hz while listening with your HA. May need a separate Music program with all the bells and whistles turned off.

Alternatively, what I am considering is to, get an equalizer and program it with my loss profile and use it to drive a pair of headphones. If you have a severe slope, like I do, you may have to look for one with extended range (most only do +/- 12dB, so max compensation is 24dB) but even an ordinary one would give you much better experience than any HA in my opinion.
Currently my simple solution is to use over the ear headphones over my hearing aids :man_shrugging: It just about makes TV watchable.

In one word, no… but we learn to listen through fog to enjoy the music! Very glad you’ve started this thread, Al.
It sounds as though you’ve done well with your Bluetooth setup, quality-wise: My aids are, from choice, quite old - Phonak M70 SP. I have recently bought a transmitter so that I can use them to listen about the house to CD and radio. It’s impressive to hear full range, down to below 40 Hz, and the quality although a bit coarse, is acceptable.
But… this is where the heartaches begin: On complex texture - string orchestra or full blown organ - the PITCH, of all things, wanders like a tired old turntable.
Surprised, I went weeping to Google - and learned that this can indeed happen with Bluetooth. Not caused by equipment but by the embedded A2DP codec commonly used, which (so far as I understand it) holds back elements of the music while processing is performed, then releases them to our ears. Oh! It afflicts BT earbuds and speakers, too.

In reply to @Levo

Phonak L-90 and open domes here. Lifelong audiophile and engineer. I have to agree with the recent posts, especially regarding almost nonexistent bass response when streaming.

In the listening room, I use the Music setting with all the disabled and a lower compression ratio equalization in the . I generally find the experience satisfactory but certainly not a match for my musical memory; there’s a lot missing at the high end especially, but that is to be expected. Overall EQ is also different from memory but tolerable. I do hear some distortion in the high treble, similar to several percent . In the end, I prefer listening WITH the aids than without, as that is a very dull experience with no sibilance etc. In fact, I am finally enjoying listening to live music again… that says something right there.

My aids sit behind my ears and only provide gain above 1 kHz. Over-the-ear phones must be “jacked up” high enough that sound reaches the mics on top of the ear. Otherwise the high end is severely rolled off. On-the-ear phones completely bypass the aids.

Edited

In reply to @al11

Hi al11:
Just curious if you noticed much of a difference in sound quality when listening to Radio Paradise in MQA compared to ‘regular’ Amazon Unlimited?
I have an external DAC being fed via Coax from my NODE(N130) and before I bought the external DAC I listened for a while using the DAC in the NODE,but could not really tell any appreciable difference in sound quality when listening to MQA.
My current external DAC does not support MQA,which is fine by me,so maybe my full range speaker rig is not revealing enough to squeeze the MQA details from the track?..I dunno.
Do you notice any sound quality difference when listening via Radio Paradise MQA or AMZ
Unlimited,song for song?.Thanks,Huck

In reply to @user36

I specifically have not linked my aids with my laptop. I don’t want the constant connecting/disconnecting as audio is played, then stopped. I don’t listen to music on my laptop anyway, so it wasn’t an issue for me.

And as I said above, and in contrast to some other posts, I am VERY happy with music streaming from my phone, thru BT, to my /. It is wonderful!

In reply to @huck

I enjoy Radio Paradise (RP) these days mostly as constantly streaming to my L90s/Activevents with custom molds and the program setting that allows a good deal of surrounding ambient sound to come through (need to hear my wife). I had the lows below 1K boosted by 10db. When I play the RP MQA output via a tube amp to my ZMF cans it is really great sounding. I don’t try to compare to the non-MQA from RP. The Amazon music I listen to also sounds very good but I typically choose their highest quality track/albums.

My Starkey Halo 2s were a bit tinny, but my P90s sound good to me with streaming. Of course, my hearing loss has been since birth so it’s hard to compare to earbuds in my opinion.

In reply to @al11

Interesting use case. I don’t think the Marvel was as robust as the Paradise and lumity are. If connecting to your computer BT hasn’t just worked right away (turn all other bt connections off), the easiest thing may be to pick up a TV connector. My concern is, if you’re playing something like counter strike I’m not sure how well it will support localization compared to a headset, but usually there’s a return period. The other annoying thing about the tv connector is that if it doesn’t detect an audio stream it will flip out of streaming, so if you’re talking for too long it will flip out, and if the volume it too low for a little while it would flip out.

This is a great thread. I, too, have Phonak L90s with ActiveVents but the point about being limited by the codec is valid. So I tried this: for dedicated music listening, commuting or lawnmowing I got a pair of Avantree Aria Me (about $125) headphones and give the a rest. You can program them roughly yourself to your hearing loss, which takes about 5 minutes. The key thing is they have Apt X, Apt X HD and and Apt Low Latency BT codecs. You can get that from a $20 music BT dongle on your laptop or Apt X from an Android phone. Also has noise cancelling for the lawnmower and commuting noise. Definitely worth a try.

AFAIK, will replace in-call codec too, for mic input, which at the moment is even worse than SBC (mSBC) and is truly horrid.

Yes. I was all set to get the impressions but the audiologist advised against them. She thought they would block too much low frequency sound. However, I guess that’s what the ActiveVents are for. She doesn’t usually prescribe Phonaks.
Thank you for the reply.

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