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Both Phonak Sphere & Philips 9050

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Been meaning to post an update -
I have gotten to really love the Spheres!
It required spending days, both adjusting, learning, as well as resting… just letting the ears go silent every so often.
The Phonak Spheres and the Phone app for them as well as the Target software for DIYers, is MORE diverse and powerful.

Perhaps due to my Oticon use for many years, the Philips seemed more intuitive, but if you put the time in, the Spheres sing!

I have committed to keeping them. And will be returning the Philips.
In order to have a back up set of speakers, in case a wire breaks, and also to be able to decide which I prefer - I am getting the UP molds. Figure they may be more comfortable, or block loud noise at social events more.

Someone had suggested that I try the Phonak fitting rationale which I rejected after first trying it early on… but NOW, with MY OWN in SITU (called audiogramDirect in the software) I am using Phonak’s Digital Contrast 3

I have two questions:
First is about in the actual field - meaning with a notebook on location - if anyone has done this, and if it was worth the effort. I have a modern ultra slim Dell with a long life battery, and can velcro the Noah Wireless with a six inch cable to the cover. But lazy to move the programs to that, if it won’t be of major use.

My second question is about the in situ test itself. Or any hearing test. Is it better to mark the point that you just faintly hear… you hear something, but aren’t able to identify tone, pitch, timber, resonance…shape. OR do you mark it only when it is strong enough to actually HEAR - like CLEARLY! I may have asked this before, but its like at the optician’s - 1 or 2, sometimes it is so fleeting a difference, it is not really apparent.

I imagine that this uncertainty, can lead to various problems with how some sophisticated processing behaves, and such problems could be further complicated by one’s inconsistence - for example sometimes leaning towards requiring a louder pulse point, and other times not.
I have always questioned my responses, when going for a hearing test anywhere and have never felt any assurances practitioners gave were of any help in knowing I was on the right track.

@IGZO said:

My second question is about the in situ test itself. Or any hearing test. Is it better to mark the point that you just faintly hear… you hear something, but aren’t able to identify tone, pitch, timber, resonance…shape. OR do you mark it only when it is strong enough to actually HEAR - like CLEARLY! I may have asked this before, but its like at the optician’s - 1 or 2, sometimes it is so fleeting a difference, it is not really apparent.

I would like to ask also about the rules for setting / in in situ tests—first slight loudness discomfort? Maybe more? Or something that causes a grimace?

In reply to @IGZO

Excellent question, as to whether to mark the point where you just faintly hear or where the sound is stronger… I’ve run hearing tests in both Phonak Target and Widex Compass both ways, to compare the results. My impression is that results in both programs using faintly heard points result in very comfortable fittings, with no obvious feeling of the unnecessarily increasing volume above what would seem natural or switching programs. Sometimes it can be difficult to distinguish the tones from tinnitus, so performing this test in one’s own home with the ability to repeat the signal if unsure, is an advantage. Using strongly heard tones sometimes caused feedback in certain frequencies, which then needed to be compensated for, and I found myself doing a lot more messing around with the apps to adjust for discomfort. Having worn HA for around 12 years, I don’t think it’s a matter of acclimating to the sound. Either way though, speech in noise is still a problem!

In reply to @Bimodal_user

Yes, I kind of settled on allowing slightly more power in the upper frequencies, which have less energy to begin with so they seem less likely to damage my ears further. And possibly could be useful to speech intelligibility and some mechanical sounds that are helpful like hearing falling screw bounce about to help find it.

BUT that is the exact same thing - so was kind of economizing on words - which now I have made up for :joy:

In reply to @tori.naess50

Thank you - for that feedback, I think it will be helpful to me.
I had begin to get that impression but with all I tend to be involved with - sometimes I get lazy when it comes to the “one more test” .

Excuse me! You have copied and then replied to an INCOMPLETE quote: A partial sentence!! Here below is exactly what I wrote:

@IGZO said:

Some extremely reliable companies promise Firmware upgrades and always deliver - like Nikon. Others have disappointed me in the past.
Phonak is an unkown to me, and if Auracast is not for sure - imminent. Then that alone must be a deciding factor.

As has been said - technology will continue to improve. So not sure how much I should be tempted by a small Sphere benefit that could quickly become old.

Before I wrote that, I had been in touch with several manufacturers who matter-of-factly said how SHOULD become more mainstream in the near future. I don’t know what you are objecting to in my post? But either everyone here should be calling Phonak and other MFGs DAILY to ask them to upgrade the firmware, OR we should be accepting what posters have said in opposition to my urgings, that Phonak and the rest are waiting for Auracast to be more popular. Which to me makes no sense…
So Baltazard - what is YOUR point here?

sorry, I didn’t read the rest, as I’ve stopped reading at that sentence I’ve quoted.
The rest as you’ve quoted is even worst.
But, that’s your opinion, hi hi, free speach after all even if it is from Elom Nusk.

I thought that the primary concern of hard of hearing is “Hearing”, then understanding, all these extra technologies are just that, Extra.

For you, is a deal breaker in choosing hearing aids, rather than how the hearing aids perform, bearing in mind that there is an ocean of differences between within the same manufacturer, not to mention between manufacturers, in trrm of performances and sound rendering.

Anywhoo, you are absolutely correct if Auracast is your main feature in HA, go for it; but, I don’t believe it is a priority for the majority, as you can see from this forum, most of us if not all of us want ZERO background noise while in conversation, so we can understand and socialise, better hearing, better , better battery life,…
The Sphere allowed backgrounds noise reduction at the expenses of battery life, but it is an advancement nevertheless… which other manufacturer will try to replicate.
Anyway, as long as we get better in harnessing technology to improve our hearing and sound + speech understanding in various situtation, plus better symbiosis with phones, then that all that matters.

I am not rushing into , what I have now is more than enough, despite my smartphone has 5.3 and Auracast feature.

I would rather wait for all the ‘childhood problems’ with the new technology to be ironed out than be bothered by potentially unproven reliability. Of course, YMMV.

In reply to @Baltazard

I have the spheres. I am keeping the spheres. I wrote on this thread about that. My computer work involves collaboration with associates who also need to hear quality sound in real time without latency to the screen. will easily allow for this.

Furthermore, in today’s age of vaccine fears - where herd immunity is increasingly unlikely, not having to don publicly handled headsets could be of real value.

Finally in my work around large crowds with large sound systems, and in houses of worship, amid the growing senior population I expect Auracast will become valuable.

Most to the point, as one investing in pricey hearing aids that are meant to last years… and doing so now, due to improved technology, why should I not be anxious about the activation of a feature that is boasted of in the sales literature on the product. WHY?

What is your reason to argue this ?

Nobody, I mean literally nobody forced you to get the Sphere, if is your numero uno feature you want, then see elsewhere.
I can’t speak on behaf of manufacturer on why and when …in implementing Auracast in their hearing aids, but for my use case, classic bluetooth in Phonak’s hearing aids does what I need.
Do I want Auracast? Yes, sure.
Do I need it? Not really, as I don’t have any Auracast devices.

3 to 5 years lifespan isn’t too long of a wait, but it could be a huge time frame for HA advancement, so If you are thinking in keeping these Sphere for at least 3 years, you will be disappointed in no time, as Phonak tend to release new Audeo around the 2 years mark, with moar tech, IA, features,…

@DaveL said:

Speech in noise is an issue for me

I’m getting decent results by using the “Calm Situation” program, but reducing the noise reduction as they make the target voice sound dull. Calm Situation (in P90 & L90) has “Speech enhancer”.

20250307_161852

Sadly, “Speech enhancer” is only available in “Calm situation”, and also sadly, there’s no slider for it in the App.
Peter

Hi, out of curiosity and interest, I will try to look at that screen in the next few days. However, have you tried playing the sounds you have trouble with… say from news, or tv, or YouTube over the speakers of your computer… while using a frequency display on a sound scanner app… I think I am using the Sonic tools app.
You should be wearing your instruments and have them activated.
Then very gently adjusting the gain on the low volume in that frequency?

Edited

In reply to @IGZO

Update on my interaction with Phonak support.
After a thirty minute conversation with JEROME at Phonak
800-777-7333 last week, he was supposed to reach out to me by this past Wednesday. I did not expect he would. I followed up today.
It is not easy getting past their switchboard, to speak to the same person. But I brought my telephone communication skill to bear, and while struggling with that operator, Jerome called me back from his office. He remembered our discussion… about the Phone App’s defects. And the firmware update for .

He wants to be helpful - BUT as my dealer says - it is vital that CONSUMERS CALL if we have complaints. I am not fully in agreement. I feel that dealers should have more power of the purse, but they don’t have the motivation that us - end user investors in a vital tool - should have. So I still urge people to call.
And also to email.
While on the phone with me, he sent me an email - proving that he still had it in his records - trying to sum up what we discussed. I recognized it as mostly a boiler plate letter. Nonetheless - he insists that upper management does care to hear and wants to improve.
The email he sent me from was info@phonak.com
You can email that address - with the issues I list below.
My main issues with the app are:
The ambient sound should not activate, when adjusting the streaming volume if one had it off to begin with. The speaker icon should be a microphone icon. That icon should not indicate the “next” mode but the current mode. Ideally the best solution would be to abandon the balance button and simply have two volume bars - one for source and one for ambient ( Mic sound) - so simple and easy to operate.
There should be some basic EQ options in Streaming mode. So often I find that the base is too strong on the stream source for example… but what am I to do? The Philips has EQ in streaming mode.

IF the app disconnects or other disconnect occurs, the alert banner should not obscure vital controls on the app!**
And of course, the Auracast firmware update should be released - even if not perfect, or not widely in demand - and they should announce a date of release, so that current and future purchases can know it is not just a hope!
If anyone has any question as to why these changes would be advantageous, please don’t hesitate to ask me.

In reply to @PeterH

@PeterH

Thanks Peter!

I’ve been getting heck because I haven’t responded when I’m being talked to.

Today I changed my again. My domes. Brushed my Phonak microphones.

I’m so frustrated.

I don’t have a pc. I would have bought a noahlink.

3 years of ownership. Phonak Audeo Paradise P90Rs. They were both replaced at end of warranty.

I’ve been a burden for my practitioner. A client for a year and a half

Over 20 years of hearing aid use. 1 Widex. And 3 pair of Phonak .

In reply to @IGZO

I’m aware of the graphic in the app. The effect of Speech enhancer seems more subtle than boosting the highs with the graphic.

I have 3 fixed programmes and rarely use the app.To me, pulling my phone out mid conversation isn’t ideal, wheras a long press is quicker

I think we can objectively say the Phonak Spheres2 are the winner here…

They’re currently rated the best overall hearing aid here5 on the Hearing Tracker website. Plus, with an entire chip dedicated to speech clarity, particularly in noisy environments, they seem to check all your boxes.

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