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New to hearing aids. I am a musician...need advice

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So Hi All,

I have noise related hearing loss and it accelerated a few years ago when I was shooting and my ear protectiors came off from recoil. I play the clarinet. I can function in my wind symphony pretty well and hear the music…but I am afraid that my own tonal concept may have drifted, per my wife. Went to costco 2 years back and tried a pair for a month and hated them. I picked up a device call the Etymotic Bean, which I use in one ear throughout the day and it is fine…even when listening to music, but you cant play with it in…sounds like a kazoo. So I did some research and got a lot of kudos from forums about Widex hearing aids for musicians. I picked up a refurbished pairof Widex 440 dreams cheap from a trusted ebay vendor who even programs them for you from your hearing test. They do work…but the music and esp my playing sound extremely tinny and harsh…I am now try to find an audiologist who might help me or some programming suggestions

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In reply to @user339

I’m new to all this too. I’m a scientist and know quite a lot about signal processing. It’s difficult but I am finally digging up a lot of technical information. What I am finding is that most of the companies use essentially the same general algorithm although implementations may vary. The first thing I said to myself was these algorithms probably make a mess of music. I tried with an expensive pair (I see no need to trash the brand) but returned them after 3 months. While looking for that used a different algorithm, I found that Lucid offerred at Sam’s Club and maybe Walmart uses a very different algorithm with far higher frequency resolution. I will probably try them and they have lots of models at different price points. They told me I could try them all and walk around the store. I know you need to try longer but at least you can find some that might work. I have the same issue with tinniness that you describe. Every time the audiologist would adjust them, the quality got better but over time it worsened. Again, now that I understand more about the algorithm, I’m not at all surprised. Keep in touch

Were you wearing the hearing aids when you were set up? They need to be in your ears when programmed & ensure the full set up has been followed ie hearing aid type, sensogram, feedback calibration & vent size selected if there is one. A custom fit will always give better results. You may like to try the music programme whilst you are checking the set up.

Hi @user339,

Welcome to the forum. I am not an audi nor scientist but I have a little bit of understanding and an excellent audiologist. Until I met my current audi, I too used to suffer from annoyance at the tinniness of music and also a warbling in the string section. He explained something to me that I have not seen mentioned anywhere else online. Apparently hearing aids are not usually able to go much below 120hz which is about an octave below middle C. That can explain the tinniness. The only way to combat that is to ensure that you have open domes which let in the lower frequencies - but they can be a problem for some people (like me) with more extreme hearing loss who need a closed solution.

The warbling can be due to the feedback suppression mechanism in the but a good audi can set them up to minimize or eliminate that.

At any rate, the secret to all modern HA problems is to find a good audiologist. may be another way to got but only if you are very technical and do a lot of research to ensure that you do not inadvertently do more harm than good.

@user339 , as a general rule, audis will not program unless you have bought the HAs from the audi at full price. There are some rare exceptions. So I think most people who buy used HAs have to embrace self-programming.

I believe Widex has an unique, proprietary programming method called the Sensogram that is crucial to an optimal setup. So you might not be able to achieve an optimal setup for your Widex HAs without finding an audi to do it for you.

Widex will not work well for every user, not even for every musician user. I’d suggest either biting the bullet and buying from an audi (or Costco), which would allow you to try a couple of different brands and avail yourself of the audi’s expertise. Or fully embrace self-programming and buy a few different used HAs, program them yourself, and then re-sell the ones you didn’t like. IMHO, you either have to spend a lot of money or a lot of time to get an optimal setup. Good luck.

If you search this forum there’s a pdf available on other threads that you can bring in to your audiologist to use for setting up ’s for musicians. It’s very good Aids need to have a few very simple adjustments made on a a dedicated program for playing music; other programs remain the same for regular life situations. One day this forum may establish a pin or whatever they’re called on the home page that would easily link to the several pdfs available for this particular issue. It comes up all the time. The adjustments make a world of difference for musicians; night and day.

In reply to @ziploc

@ziploc said:

I believe Widex has an unique, proprietary programming method called the Sensogram that is crucial to an optimal setup. So you might not be able to achieve an optimal setup for your Widex HAs without finding an audi to do it for you.

You can do this yourself no problem, it’s in-situ so pretty good results for some people.

thanks for all this info. I still think I will go with my used vendor because he is trustworthy and has a programmer to do intial setup via my last hearing test. I just got an online tone generator to test high frequencies. Without the aids, my hearing stopped at 7969hz, with one programmed dream in the right ear, I got 8612 with one in my left ear, I got 8254. The investment is minimum at 600 vs 6000 and I would like to be able to tweak them as I go along. Speech hearing is not a problem with the intial program I got , even music listening and tv watching are ok…its when I actually play that the problem persists. Should I go with the Beyond 440 or the Evoke 440…same price.

I believe the Beyond is not sold on the open market any more so Widex servicing may not be supported (servicing that was performed elsewhere for me delivered inferior components/less skill-Boots surprisingly did this reducing performance & sound quality. In my experience it makes a big difference so I always ensure they are using Widex now).

The Evoke is the newer model so would perform better for you. The Moment has the fastest processing speed and means music is the most natural it’s ever sounded. I did still love listening to music with the Evoke 440 though and in my experience have always found the magic in sound with the Widex sound over any others I tried.

In reply to @user339

@user339 said:

its when I actually play that the problem persists. Should I go with the Beyond 440 or the Evoke 440…same price.

Yes, this is the point that I and others are making. I’m a musician. I suggest you go to Associaton of Adult Musicians with Hearing Loss forum. You will see that ALL musicians need to have their aids tweaked in order to overcome all sorts of issues. And/or read the pdf that Tenkan linked to. Your aids aren’t going to work for playing music until some easy steps are taken. As far as I know, no will.

I have been checking out their materials. Not much specific info yet. I am now participating in their facebook group. Hope to find someone with similar issues, specific to clarinet, which I hear, is a problamatic instrument for s.The Evoke has a soundsense app thru your phone that lets you adjust to the environment.

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