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Phonak introduces Marvel platform and Audéo M hearing aids

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In reply to @glennwiltse

I have been pouring over the specs sheet lately. From what I understood:-

  1. Music is included as an additional program in M50 and M70. So you can switch manually. Since you can have only three additional programs, make sure you let the audiologist know that you need this program.
  2. However, for the Autosense mode to have the ability to switch to Music mode automatically, it is possible only in M70.

I’m on day 2 of my trial of the M70R. Typical hearing loss due to age and years of working in loud manufacturing environments. I’ve never worn anything but earbuds before.

These are very comfortable for me & I’m still getting used to the new sounds. I go back to the Audiologist next week for my 1st adjustments.

I was awake around 4AM yesterday (insomnia) & put them on shortly thereafter. Around 7, I went out & did my morning 4 miles and ran Bluetooth music from my phone music to them for about 90 minutes… Did occasional Blutetooth connections for music or videos throughout the day… When I took them off at 9:30PM, they had 25% charge remaining.

I’m liking the battery life!!

In reply to @slowcoach

Yes, that was my basic understanding, that the additional programs were available, yet my audiologist acted like she had never heard of such a thing and insisted that my M50 hearing aids didn’t have any access to a music program, or any other programs that wasn’t included in the AutoSense OS. It seems that I may have to educate my audiologist and/or get them to explain to tell me how much ( hopefully nothing ), that it will cost me to get additional programs added.

I managed to get an appointment with them for tomorrow afternoon. So, I should know a lot more about what they can or will do for me, by the end of tomorrow.

What I’ve determined on my own, is that the problem occurs from about 1500 Hz, on up to at least 4000 Hz. It’s a little unclear to me if the issue exists above 4000Hz, but it seemed to lessen, or cease completely. I’ve also come to realize that it isn’t just occurring during music, that’s just when it becomes most obvious. I hear it in certain normal every day speech, depending on the tone of a person’s voice and how long they produce a relatively steady tone in their speech.

UPDATE - iPhone XS call streaming issue RESOLVED!
So everyone knows, I have M90’s with an iPhone XS. I am now able to stream phone calls correctly.
Your Audi will need to update their Target software to 6.0.2. and they will need to update the firmware in the hearing aids. Under the Device Options>Bluetooth, they will need to change the setting from “Adaptive” to “Fixed.” Adaptive is the default but for the iPhone XS and XS Max, it needs to be “Fixed.”

Dan,
Not that I’m aware of. I will check with my sources and see what I can find out.

Dave
(DbMtX)

Reading the press release, you would think the Marvel hearing aids have fantastic Bluetooth connectivity. The reality is that their Bluetooth connectivity is very inflexible and unreliable. I found this out by trying them. There are two major show-stopping flaws with their Bluetooth connectivity. First, they can only be paired with one device at a time. If you want to switch devices, you must disconnect them, then re-pair them with the new device. If you want to go back to the previous device, you must go through the same process again. EVERY TIME! If you use them with a laptop, you must reboot the computer before the hearing aids will connect. Often, even after pairing, they do not connect reliably. Often, you have to turn them off and on several times before they connect. Second, they disconnect frequently while in use. This is very disruptive if you are in a call, such as with Skype. They are unusable for professional purposes, such as business communication. I found these two fundamental limitations to be show-stoppers, so I returned them and purchased Oticon Opn 1 hearing aids, which do not have these limitations. They can be paired with multiple devices and they never disconnect. The Marvels are an unfinished product. I discussed the above issues at length with my audiologist. She discussed them with Phonak and they would not commit to addressing either of the issues. Their response was just excuses. If you are considering Marvels for Bluetooth connectivity, you are wasting your time.

Edited

I have Phonak Audeo Marvel M90-R rechargeables.
I have an Android Google Pixel 3 XL phone.
My phone provider is Google Fi.
My WiFi provider is Comcast XFinity.
My computer is a Microsoft Surface Pro running Windows 10 Pro.

I got my Marvels on Dec 26th, so today I’ve had them for two months. I’ve had them long enough to know that for me they are reliable and I will definitely not be returning them. I will agree with you on one of your points and I will disagree on the other.

  1. Pairing to more than one device is definitely a routine that requires several minutes to do. And yes, it’s a pain in the butt. I’ve paired with my Windows 10 computer and it works just fine. It isn’t that quick to do, but if you know what you’re doing, it works just fine, it’s just time consuming to do it. I’ve not had the problem you’re talking about of having to reboot my computer to pair my Marvels.

  2. Bluetooth reliability once paired has, for me, been absolutely reliable when on WiFi. When my phone connection is to cell towers, it can be unreliable as it can be for anyone. If my cell tower connection is lost, the Bluetooth phone connection is, of course, lost. That’s obvious and has absolutely nothing to do with the Bluetooth reliability of the Marvel. On WiFi I can listen to streaming music from my Google Play Music subscription for hours at a time with no interruptions. In the two months I’ve had my Marvels I’ve yet to have a phone conversation be dropped or disconnected with either a WiFi or cellular connection.

I’m waiting for the Bluetooth issue to be fixed as I’m confident it will be. Even if it doesn’t get fixed, the excellent audio quality and reliability of my Marvels streaming both phone calls and music is the reason I’m keeping them.

In reply to @darylm

darylm,

I’ll agree on the single pairing. It’s a pain and doesn’t work with multiple devices. The Marvels clear the pairing each time you pair a new device, but the other system still has it in it’s system. Some handle that okay when you pair again, but I’ve found similar issues with laptops/PCs that they struggle with this making it really difficult to switch devices even when going through the re-paring process. I truly hope they get this issue sorted and I haven’t made up my mind on whether or not I’ll keep these just because of this reason. I may end up trialing the Oticon, but I will not use an iPhone.

On the reliability of the connection though, they have been absolutely rock solid. I’ve yet to drop a call, drop streaming, drop a notification. I have zero complaints about the reliability of the connection once it’s in place. I walk all around the house, the office, etc. and it just works. Period. It’s hard for me to reconcile the short comings on the functionality, but they did seem to get the reliability right for me. Not sure what kind of device you have issues with on the reliability side, but it would be nice to know.

In reply to @glennwiltse

Well, here’s the update on the odd warbling sound I have been experiencing on my Marvel M50-312 hearing aids.

I believe but am not 100% positive that the root cause of the warbling sounds I experienced , was mostly related to Phonak’s SoundRecover2. My audiologist disabled that this morning, and things seem to have improved in the AutoSense OS related sound quality after she’s done that. I think I still here some warble in certain tones, but it’s much much less noticeable , to the point where I may just be imagining it. Now, I haven’t had a chance to try this on the original situation that caused me to have concern about it ( while playing electric guitar ), but, I really think that SoundRecover was what was causing the issue. I further believe this , from reading the description of what SoundRecover is doing. That being ‘shifting frequencies’… and they mention that it starts at 1500 hz, which is exactly the frequency where I started noticing the problem ( I have a tone generator, it was very noticeable from 1500 Hz on up to around 4000Hz.) So, I’m 99.9% certain SoundRecovery2 is the root cause.

Meanwhile, as for program availability outside of AutoSense OS. My audiologist seemed to have been being strategically withholding information from me previously when she acted as if my hearing aids had no access to a Music program. It seems , that they really want new hearing aid users to get used to the hearing aids their ‘out of the box’ ( these are all my own words, and my own interpretation of my audiologists thought process and/or standard procedures she seems to use ). I think when I previously asked her about the Music feature, she intentionally didn’t want to tell me about it, just to avoid getting into a long discussion about things of that nature. When I went there today, she was very forthcoming about the additional programs and parameters that she could change. Apparently with new hearing aid users, she really wants them to get used to the hearing aids at a basic level, before she starts changing stuff. I can understand this, so I really have no qualms with how she’s operating in this regard.

So, she’s made Music, Speech in Nose, and Comfort in noise programs available to me, where I can manually enter these modes. She was showing me how there are some adjustments she can make within these programs too, and I believe if I actually wanted to have her tweak them in the future, she would be willing and able to do that. Now, for me, a person who’s worked and lived with many highly technical devices and such my whole life, I personally wish I myself had access to these adjustments myself, or even custom make my own manual program. But I don’t think that this is available to me, or any other consumers ( someone please correct me if I’m wrong, or help me find out more ).

So, if I have any complaints at this point, they are that as a person who is fully capable of understanding technology, I wish I had been more informed right from the start about the many features that seem to be kept hidden from the consumer, only shared by audiologists who feel the need. I understand how that could potentially make things way more complicated for most users who aren’t as tech savvy as myself, but still. This is the 21st century and people my age and younger have clearly been living with technology our whole lives and some of us even embrace it. So, I do wish I had more information given to me from the start.

Glad that your conversation with the Audiologist went well. Her approach is very common with new users starting out with amplification. I’m not saying it is the right approach - especially with tech-savvy, tech-engaged younger users - but I’m glad that based on your interest in having more control that she has provided it via the programs and her offer to further tweak.

One thing that I would say is that the further control you’re wanting over the experience is not possible with nearly any brand of hearing aid. Phonak’s current app doesn’t provide much, if any, control over the sound even with a basic equalizer (which the apps of other brands include). The best control over the hearing aid from my experience is offered through Widex’s app and most-importantly, through their SoundSense learn feature which enables the user to “dial-in” their preferred sound by listening to a series of A/B comparisons of the sound provided by the hearing aid and choosing the preferred one each time until satisfied. I’ve worn hearing aids for 18 years and, like you, always wished for more control in-the-moment when the sound wasn’t to my liking. Now, I have it. Coupled with the great sound I get from Widex, I’m a convert (and, I guess, from this note an evangelist, too!).

I definitely believe in the Phonak brand and in Marvel, but I did want to let you know about another option for you if user control is more important in the long run. . .

Relative to “warbling”…is this the same thing I am calling “reverberation” for example when I whistle? Hugely annoying! I am experiencing this frequently with my M90’s.

The other issue I am experiencing is no matter what we have tried, the right “rattles” as a blown speaker would for certain sounds and no amount of tuning by my Audi seems able to correct that. That is with open and custom domes.

I may have to resort to living with my OPN1’s even though they are horrible for me in noisy situations.

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