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Phonak Roger On iN - problems connecting to TV / A/V amplifier

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Hi all,

I have a roger On iN and want to directly connect it so that I can hear television more clearly.

Phonak supply an optical connecting cable (sometimes called “toslink”) that can be plugged into the back of a regular TV. The other end is plugged into the combined audio/optical socket on the Roger On iN charger stand.

We don’t have a regular TV. Our “TV” is actually an IPTV box that is connected to our Hi-Fi and a projector. Sound to the loudspeakers works fine. But I can’t hear the loudspeaker sound clearly, so want to use the Roger On iN connected with that optical cable.

My Hi-Fi amplifier has an optical output that accepts the Phonak optical cable. When I plug it in, the pinpoint red light can be seen on the charger stand end of the optical cable. I connect the optical cable to the iN charger stand and “dock” the iN. A music note symbol appears on the iN’s display, but I hear nothing, even if the volume buttom on the iN charger is set to maximum.

Thinking that there might be something wrong with the amplifier’s optical output, I then bought a small box of electronics that converts output from stereo RCA phono to optical. Same story. When I plug it in to the phono output of the amplifier, the pinpoint red light can be seen on the charger stand end of the optical cable. I connect the optical cable to the iN charger stand and “dock” the iN. As before, the music note symbol appears on the iN’s display, but I hear nothing, even if the volume button on the iN charger is set to maximum.

I’m pretty knowledgeable about this sort of thing but am now stumped.

Does anyone have any suggestions please?

Richard

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@bulk said:

Our “TV” is actually an IPTV box that is connected to our Hi-Fi and a projector. Sound to the loudspeakers works fine.

LOL! I am walking in your shoes. What is the MODEL and MAKE of your IPTV box connected to the hi-fi unit? You can then find out what kind of audio output is on the back of this unit (analog, digital) and then use either an analog cable or digital toslink cable to connect to your Roger V2 base.

I also have a HUGE Samsung TV mounted to the wall - no way to get to the back of it. On top of which ALL sound is routed through a Marantz “home theatre” hi-fi system. So currently, I have an analog cable plugged in to the back of the unit that’s long enough to reach the Roger V2 base sitting on a small table next to the chair I sit in.

I plug the Roger V2 stick into the base, and voila! Sound comes from the Marantz through the analog cable and into the Roger base.

Hope that helps. You’re close to the solution, but just need to know what kind of cable (analog, digital) will get the job done. And make sure it’s LONG enough to reach from the back of the IPTV unit to your Roger V2 base.

In reply to @michael1

@michael1 said:

Do you have any sound output selection on your amplifier?

That is another key point! I have to change the sound output on my Marantz hi-fi box depending on whether I’m watching a DVD, AmazonPrime or live TV. Very annoying, but the system was already set up in the house when we bought it. :neutral_face:

In reply to @firenzel

There is no possibility to change the program. The On iN display changes automatically to a musical note symbol as soon as the Tos cable is connected. I think it seems the PCM carrier but without data, so others who suggested checking the amp output selection may be on the right track. Research continues!

Thanks.

In reply to @1Bluejay

My IPTV box is actually a nVidia Shield, and it’s excellent. The only outputs are HDMI, one of which is connected to our Denon AV. From there, the video goes to a projector, the audio to loudspeakers.

Analog - that’s a thought. I’d overlooked that. I will root through my cable box for an appropriate cable. Analogue from the RCA pin audio output jacks on the back of the Denon to a 3.5 mm stereo jack.

Thanks!

firenzel, and @all,

I think you are correct! On careful re-reading of the 1" thick Denon manual, it makes clear that digital (HDMI) (video) signals are never converted to any of the analog outputs. I’m guessing that also means audio signals are not converted either. Guess 2 is that this is because of HDMI copy protection!

So, looked for a HDMI Audio Extractor. Found several but the Goobay HDMI Audio Extractor seems good at a reasonable price and available quickly from a local supplier. It has HDMI inputs/passthrough and analog outputs plus Toslink. OK, Tos is digital, but does not support HDMI copy protection.

The Roger On iN finally produced Denon sound after I exactly followed the manual. i used the 62 Phonak-supplied cable that has USB-C one end and a 3.5mm jack the other. Plugging the 3.5mm jack directly into the Denon front panel and the usb-C directly into the USB-C on the iN worked. But of course sound to the loudspeakers was cut off.

I’m working towards 1Bluejay’s solution. I want the iN charging stand on a side table so that it charges and is also handy for changing the volume.

I will report back! The pile of unused adapters and cables is growing!

I’m pretty technical, but wonder how folks who are less technical (maybe older too) cope with this!

Hmm, slight change of tack (I must love complexity)!

I found myself wondering why I am not attempting to split out the audio to analog and Bluetooth it to my excellent Apple Air Pods. With that thought, Google was consulted and it spat out this: PROZOR HDMI to Audio+bluetooth Transmitter.2.

Now, if it meets all the promises, this gadget looks very interesting! It supports 5, which the Phonak support, but also looks like I could link to my Air Pods. I’m happy with just using the Air Pods to listen to TV because frankly the audio quality is far better, especially since with Apple’s transparency mode and the supported low-latency Bluetooth codecs, I should be able to hear my wife’s comments on the program.

I can foresee a potential problem with transparency because I’ll also hear the TV sound directly. If there’s any latency, that’s going to be very disturbing.

“Can be paired with 2 Bluetooth headsets or speakers at the same time”, so theoretically I can pair it to the Phonak HAs and Air Pods at the same time.

But, amazon says “Unavailable, don’t know when”.

Sigh…

Edited

I have experienced a similar issue. My Roger is connected to an older Marantz 7001. The input I use to watch streaming is a Nvidia Shield. YouTube TV is the only input that is output to the Roger successfully. YouTube, Amazon’s Prime and others do not create an output that is usable by my Roger. Have you tried different input sources to see if your situation is similar.
Update: I ordered a Fire TV from Amazon and connected it to the Marantz. All channels provided a signal that was accepted or downgraded to a format that is processed by the Marantz and can be heard in the Roger On. So the issue appears to be that the Nivida Shield apparently is not outputting a format for most channels that can be used by the Marantz 7001 for optical output.

The problem I have is that the Denon amp book explicitly says (with a diagram) that the HDMI video signals are never converted to analogue. But it ONLY says that mentioning audio.

I think you are on the right track when you talk about different input sources, so will look again into that, but I also think there’s something else I don’t understand.

Since this seems to affect ALL analog output, (phono, Tos), I will find a Denon forum and ask some questions there.

I will feed back, and any other suggestions are welcomed

@bulk OK, this confuses me a bit. It has been a long time since I set up my theater and dabbled in sound knowledge. Most of everything I ever knew has been forgotten. However, Toslink (optical) is digital so I am not sure why you would want to convert to analog if using the Toslink cable. I found a good refresher article which I found helpful. Optical Digital Audio Cable & Connection Explained | Home Cinema Guide3.

More clearly, any digital signal sources that are copy protected with the HDCP scheme used by HDMI, have to connect to a HDCP “sink” that is also HDCP. Tos is indeed digital, but has no HDCP copy protection, so no conversion.

Thanks for the link -. will study.

@bulk Ok, thanks for that. But I am still confused. Maybe I just need to do a little bit of self education. Using the Marantz 7001, all channels play from the Nvidia Shield through the Marantz and outputs correctly to the projector and in-wall speakers, so I assume that the HDCP conversion has been done. One channel (that I know of) also outputs to the Roger On. So I “assume” that any conversion has been done before outputting to the Toslink. In addition all channels, YouTube, Amazon Prime, Netflix etc. are outputted from the receiver to the Roger On when using the Amazon Fire TV. Since all channels are handled correctly by the receiver when sent directly to speakers and the projector and to the Roger using Toslink when using the Fire TV and all channels are sent correctly to speakers and projectors when using the Nvidia but only one channel (YouTubeTV) can be heard on the Roger ON, I am confused.

In reply to @bulk

@bulk said:

I’m pretty technical, but wonder how folks who are less technical (maybe older too) cope with this!

This is EXACTLY and PRECISELY why I think hearing aid makers need to wake up to the opportunity of either offering or partnering with some kind of “geek” squad that can figure all this out for us - either over a Zoom call, the phone, or a house call.

Accessories have proliferated, and home theater can be unique to each house. Even TVs are often WALL-MOUNTED with no access to the toslink port on back, let alone a wall socket nearby to plug in a TV Connector or Roger V2 base.

It’s become a spaghetti junction of cables and wires, and it’s overwhelming for us to figure out on our own.

When we buy a car, often the sales person will sit in the car with us and go through all the buttons and options. But when we buy aids, there’s NO ONE. Often even the audi is clueless about how to get these aids streaming TV at home. The options are simply too myriad!

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