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Tweaking the Oticon More

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Right. But I think with his info that his Audi did 2 clicks up and 2 clicks down in the mids for the music program should get it going in the right direction. I can tell you that the Widex are a tough act to follow for music. I also have his audio gram from his info page.

Thanks for your input.

One thing I have noticed in easy situations is that I hear very well people facing away from me, next to me, and behind me. It took turning my head to hear well to the back and side with the Widex. Facing away was a lost cause unless it was a stronger male voice and that was still difficult. I don’t want to be too harsh on the Widex though. At this point the More is only moderately better at .

Edited

I should also mention that I have substantial damage to left ear from an explosion. Aided Speech In Noise recognition is only 44% on that side. Any louder sounds are quite distorted. Not much to do about that.

In reply to @flashb1024

I am not sure, but I am not able to change the MyMusic gains for Load, moderate and soft individually because the CR Values (compression ratio’s) are fixed. So 2 down soft and 2 up for loud is not an option because of CR is fixed.

Or am I missing something in the Genie2 settings?

Below is my Fine Tuning screenshot for the MyMusic program based on my .

If you click on the CR button in the middle, it’ll show the 2 rows of compression ratios between Loud/Moderate/Soft. I find that I’m able to click up or down on a particular gain spot, and if I click enough time up or down, it may change the gain on the adjacent gain spots, either before or after it, and sometimes even the gain spots of the other rows. For example, clicking too much on the a Loud gain eventually may change the Moderate and Soft gains of that channel as well. It may also change the compression ratio displayed as well.

I haven’t found an occasion where I’m not allowed to change the gain value because the CR values are fixed. But if I keep on going, for example, keep on click up on the gain, eventually it’ll stop when it hits the max value it can sustain, and the bright red turns dark red on that gain spot and stops there. Conversely, I can keep clicking down on a gain spot until it even passes 0 and goes into negative value gains until it also eventually stops.

So I’m not sure why you’re locked out and can’t adjust the gain. The CRs are not locked up in my case. I wonder if you hit some kind of max value already in your prescription. Just as an exercise, pick any other gain spot and try to up or down its gain and observe what happens. After your experiment, you can just delete that MyMusic program and reinstall it and it’ll be all fresh again.

image

In reply to @Volusiano

@Volusiano said:

After your experiment, you can just delete that MyMusic program and reinstall it and it’ll be all fresh agai

the only quibble I’ve got with your post is that last sentence.
I found out from my audi, that the icon below the icon is the "Represcribe"action.
It sets the changes you made back to default. It also appears below the toolbar, far left.
Wild, huh? Almost like a factory reset, but not quite.

You should open the dB view, and check the Low/Med/Loud checkboxes to see if you have compression of the mids for your scrpt.

@bertvanhouten, looks like @Volusiano answered your question.

Were you able to make it sound like Music should?

If you only hear it only on one side then it’s very possible that you have a bad receiver. You may have 2 bad receivers as well if it happens on both sides, but it’s rare that such a coincidence would happen to both of them at the same time.

If you hear it on both sides, then maybe more information about your is needed to make any guess as to what’s going on. Like if you use Speech Rescue or not, because it may be caused by Speech Rescue in a particular configuration in your case.

Again, right on the spot. I noticed it was in high frequency and I could minimize it by using the sound controls (from brighter to fuller). But the real problem was indeed the Speech Rescue. I forgot I once played around with and I don’t need it, but left it on :slight_smile:
Still high frequencies sound a bit shrill in high volume music, but I think I need to get used to it. I am newby

The following may or may not be relevant. I have a Musician’s program as well as Live and Recorded music program. The Musicians program is for those playing an instrument, often close to their ears and (think violin or classical guitar). I was getting a 'warble" effect on that program. It turns out that, even though the feedback manager was turned down as low as it could go, it was still activating. The manager works by lowering tones by an octave or so. So I was hearing the notes from my instrument AND the same notes transposed down an octave. It was like having a bad chorus effect pedal on an electric guitar. Turning the feedback manager OFF entirely fixed this issue.
As for compression, as you all know it eliminates a lot of overtones and so empties music of its richness. So that needs to be lowered or off as well.

sorry if this is redundant! But my fix for the Musicians program has been entirely successful.

@jeffrey said:

I was getting a 'warble" effect on that program. It turns out that, even though the feedback manager was turned down as low as it could go, it was still activating. The manager works by lowering tones by an octave or so. So I was hearing the notes from my instrument AND the same notes transposed down an octave. It was like having a bad chorus effect pedal on an electric guitar. Turning the feedback manager OFF entirely fixed this issue.

There are 3 strategies employed by the traditional feedback manager, and usually at the same time.

  1. Limit gain.
  2. Phase change.
  3. Frequency shifting. This may vary depending on the brand, but for Oticon, if I remember correctly, it’s only a 10 Hz shift, not a whole octave shift. I think an octave shift up doubles the frequency of the pure tone, and conversely halves that frequency on an octave shift down. They only shift everything by 10 Hz to minimize the perception that the music is out of tune.

Nevertheless, you’re correct that this frequency shifting is what is causing the warbling effect. It’s especially more noticeable on pure tones. You hear the shifted note through your HAs, and you hear the natural unshifted note going through the vent in your domes and hitting your ear drums naturally. The 2 are out of sync by 10 Hz, obviously enough sometimes to create the warbling effect due to slightly out-of-sync cancellation spots when the 2 waveforms are combined.

Yep; I was uncertain as to how far the frequencies were being shifted. I have the Signia AX7. I frequent a forum for adult musicians with hearing loss. this issue comes up all the time across all brands. Many–most?–hearing aid audis are unfamiliar with this whole phenomenon or for tweaking aids for musicians in general. Mine wasn’t either but she was willing to work with me on this. Comically, the first Signia audi tech that we worked with hadn’t a clue–and neither did I really at that point. Adjustments were made that didn’t help at all. The second Signia tech likewise had no clue. My audi let me take over essentially and turning the feedback manager off entirely was easy; as was turning off wind block -over the objections of the Signia audi who didn’t get that I play indoors where wind is not an issue. Of course all of this was confined to the one Musician program. anyway, it worked and I’m a happy camper.

My guess is that the audis all wonder how much difference could it make turning the feedback manager from the lowest setting to entirely off. All the difference in the world, it turns out.

@jeffrey said:

My guess is that the audis all wonder how much difference could it make turning the feedback manager from the lowest setting to entirely off. All the difference in the world, it turns out.

Yeah, usually the only thing you can minimize is the gain margin limit. But frequency shifting is shifting, it’s either an on or off thing so I’m not sure how you’d minimize it. Maybe you can minimize it by narrowing the amount of the shift, but I guess the 10 Hz shift that Oticon came up with is probably the minimum amount they found that they could get away with that would still help stave off the feedback already.

Yes the first Signia audi lowered gain in upper decibels. It didn’t help. Her thinking was sound, but that wasn’t the issue.

In reply to @bertvanhouten

@bertvanhouten said:

Still high frequencies sound a bit shrill in high volume music, but I think I need to get used to it.

If you use the Fitting Assistant, you can have it adjust the gain in the high frequencies down by 2 to 4 , and see if that helps.
Or, as you say, since you’re a newbie, your brain may adjust to it.
Sounds like you are on the right path!

Here’s a sample:

image

The Fitting Assistance is a great new tool that I also notice in the latest version of Genie 2. Maybe it was there but I didn’t notice before? Oh well, I just noticed it recently after I did the update to Genie 2 anyway.

Thanks for bringing it up, @flashb1024. Man, you’re quite a expert now. My truest compliment!

Hey, thanks, @Volusiano for the props, but I’m far from being an expert.
Genie 2 has a lot to offer, and spending time with it is really helping me achieve the outcome I was hoping for from the Mores.

I never thought I’d get them to sound as good as my OPNs.
Thanks to you and @pvc in the section, I’ve made good progress.
My new audi has also been helpful.

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