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Rechargeable aids: wanted by customers or by factories?

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In reply to @kevels55

@kevels55 Veering off topic, but still on the electricity theme, 3.9 pence per kilowatt is fantastic. I keep reading that the UK has high electricity rates. Is Scotland an exception? It is great that your solar/storage set-up saves you a lot of money.

In reply to @Um_bongo

@Um_bongo said:

Not if they couldn’t afford the power. It’s a straight engineering trade-off.

Accelerometer power consumption is negligible even by hearing aid standards. Here’s a product page with link to the datasheet:

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/analog-devices-inc/ADXL367BCCZ-RL7/16360579

Under “General Description” on page 1 of the datasheet you’ll find “The ADXL367 is an ultralow power, 3-axis microelectromechanical systems (MEMS) accelerometer that consumes only 0.89 µA at a 100 Hz output data rate”.

This is in microamps, while hearing aid power draw is stated in milliamps. A microamp is 1/1000 of a milliamp.

So the component power consumption is certainly negligible. Handling of the accelerometer output will use some processor power. I don’t know how to quantify that in relation to the power that the processors use to process sound. But I’d guess it’s not much.

In reply to @portage

Hello Portage… My normal price is around 27 pence per kWh, but between the hours of 12 midnight and 6am, I can charge my batteries or EV at 3.9 per kWh (that off-peak price will increase to around 8 pence per kWh in November) this is my contracted off-peak rate, I also pay a daily standing charge of 60 pence per day… Since November last year, my electricity bills, have dropped to approximately 1/5th of the normal price, and since Mid-February this year, I have bought in practically no electricity from the Grid, and I should remain self sufficient till around October time, I will then charge up the batteries at 3.9 pence Per kWh, approximately every 3 days, and run off battery power alone, my 48 kWh Lithium batteries will last me around 3 days, without being charged, I am fairly strict with my charging, I don’t let my batteries drop below 20%, and I don’t charge above 85%, this helps to prolong the longevity of the batteries, these are “Grade A Eve Cells” and should if treated well, last approximately 15 years? Once every couple of months, I equalise out the batteries, charge them up to 100%, discharge to 20%, recharge to 100% then revert back to the 85%/20% charging cycle, it should keep them good… Cheers Kev :wink:

@kevels55 Thanks! Happy Charging! What a huge difference between peak and off peak rates. We don’t have that yet in Washington State but I think we will probably sometime in the future. (I pay about 8 cents per kw - cheap by American standards)

Rechargeable hearing aids are one of the dumbest ideas of this industry. So you’re saying that hearing aids can just lose battery charge and they’re useless until you recharge them? That somehow quickly replacing two batteries is uncomfortable? Rechargeable hearing aids would be tolerable if you could connect them to the (reasonably priced, you greedy ghouls) charger with cables while having them usable in your ears, but the wireless obsession of course had to ruin everything. Same with garbage Bluetooth/etc. streaming that replaced wired connection.

In reply to @gkumar

Good question- as far as I know, no allows this. Which is interesting, because the EU has prepared legislation (usually adhered to in other markets as well) obliging manufacturers to have easily swappable battery packs in electronics. This EU Batteries Regulation (EU) 2023/1542 enters into force by 2027.

There are however “partial exceptions” for nonstandard consumables like medical devices (think also of, e.g., pacemakers). Thus “hearing aids qualify for specific medical/safety exemptions if they are sealed against moisture or if battery removal by users creates medical safety risks. In these cases, batteries can still be replaced by trained professionals.”

@RobHooft said:

“hearing aids qualify for specific medical/safety exemptions if they are sealed against moisture… In these cases, batteries can still be replaced by trained professionals.”

Does this mean that hearing aids won’t be allowed to have soldered-in rechargeable batteries, rather they’ll have to be replaceable in a fitter’s office, like Oticon models prior to Intent?

Edited

It’s all pretty murky. If rechargeable batteries are soldered in, an “expert” can still replace them, as the legislation suggest they do. Now, what I have seen in this forum is that when Phonak are sent back within their warranty period due to complaints about the batteries, users get a completely new set back, in clear violation of the spirit of the new law. So it is a tug of war, and we need an expert Brusselist here to predict how this will pan out in the end. What is clear is that manufacturers are keeping a nervous eye on what happens in the EU.

The quote says “professional”, not “expert”, and those words aren’t synonymous, in US English at least. The “professions” are law, medicine, presumably audiology, etc., and practitioners of those fields are professionals. A technician fixing a hearing aid isn’t a professional in this sense. They’re also working remotely from you, while you usually get personal service from a professional in their office. Whether EU English sees it the same way is a different matter.

Not a native English speaker, but saying a technician isn’t a professional sounds rather odd to me. I worked in many labs with technicians doing their -hum- professional job.
My take of the EU rules is that someone who does this as a day job, -not the enduser- must be able to do the replacement, whatever that person “skilled in the art” (patent language there) is called.

Admirable- I don’t have the patience at all to wade through this kind of Brusselian wordsoup (made from the original, mashed sprouts)! As a starter, I don’t understand why it must include procedures, motivations and precedence in the document, in addition to archaic language (“whereas…”).

The easiest way out here is for manufacturers to place their rechargeable batteries in a tray-like compartment just as for today’s disposables, so that they are easily swappable. This would (I think) overcome the resistance of the bulk of HA users here against rechargeables, and make Brussels happy.

Meanwhile I wonder what iPhones will look like in the future…

@RobHooft said:

The easiest way out here is for HA manufacturers to place their rechargeable batteries in a tray-like compartment just as for today’s disposables, so that they are easily swappable.

This is a tough one. Soldered connections are more reliable and a battery compartment adds bulk. Water-proofness is another issue that has already been mentioned.

On the bright side, battery technology and longevity are still improving, so maybe rechargeables will eventually have a 10 years lifetime and then we won’t have this discussion any more.

In reply to @TJN

@TJN said:

for those of us who camp, hike, travel internationally, or spend extended time away from power, replaceable batteries still offer a level of convenience and reliability that rechargeable hearing aids simply haven’t matched yet.

Hey TJN, this reply is LONG overdue as I just logged in today. Couldn’t agree with you MORE on the need for battery-powered aids. I’ve asked my audi if Phonak has shown ANY inclination to continue the battery lineup, and she says a firm “NO.” So that is sobering. I’m stuck one generation below the Infinity with my Lumity Life 312s, and they are worth EVERY PENNY spent on them. So much so, that I’d recommend you save up and even buy them on your own dime if the won’t spring for them.

O’course I love the wild colors these come in, and I don’t see any indication that Phonak’s more SENIOR models will offer anything but BMW sedan colors.

Like you, I typically spend days or even weeks off the grid, and simply can NOT go more than 14 hrs on my Lumity Life rechargeable. I wear them to the gym cuz they offer some water resistance for sweaty workouts, but otherwise, can be seen in fuschia PINK or pirate’s TEAL 312s.

My cinderblocks would probably not work with any solution, and to switch to another brand would be ugly. My mind is set up to work with Phonaks, and even these are custom-tuned by my audi to fit my own quirks.

Oh. Well. We can only keep fingers crossed! Cuz I’d even replace my 312s with 312s if Phonak keeps making them. There is no iron-clad indication they plan to do so.

In reply to @cvkemp

@cvkemp said:

If you prefer disposable batteries be prepared to get older less powerful technology

.

Stop saying this if you don’t know the full gamut of offerings.

Starkey has 312 disposable battery models that have the SAME capability as the Rechargeable twin.

This is true of their EDGE and the Omega AI models.

I have the Soundgear AMP from Costco, which is a rebrand of the Starkey EDGE AI model.

I specifically requested the Disposable Battery model. Every capability is the SAME as the Rechargeable model.

Unlike you, I don’t need to have a SPARE set of HAs. Instead, I have a small dial of 312 batteries in my side pocket.

I generally know with 4-5-6 days the battery will need replacing, depending on how much I had streamed that week.

Stay within what you have directly experienced, and don’t advise folks outside your experience box.

Edited

I have worn aids 21+ plus years. I had disposable batteries most of that time. I my opinion getting rechargeable batteries with chargers with built-in battery packs has changed everything. But to be honest if I could wear aids I would willingly go back to disposable battery aids. But that isn’t going to happen so I stand by the fact that rechargeable aids are the best and most advanced for my hearing needs. I going to say this I don’t accept or put up with anyone telling me what to say or think.

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